Block’s latest rollout quietly delivers a full Bitcoin banking stack to millions of merchants, marking its boldest step yet toward making Bitcoin everyday money.
Block’s Bitcoin leadership sat down with Marty to walk through an eight-year arc that culminated in what may be the most important Bitcoin rollout by a major public company to date: a fully native Bitcoin banking stack for four million U.S. merchants. The episode traces the lonely early years of being a Bitcoiner, the internal battles at Square/Cash App to push Bitcoin forward, and how persistent, principled focus has translated into Cash App onboarding 24 million people to Bitcoin and Square now enabling bitcoin payments across its entire seller network. The conversation details how Lightning, non-custodial prototypes, internal AI tooling, and a deep company-wide orange-pilling campaign made it possible to ship a series of releases at a pace that previously seemed impossible. Block’s strategy centers on three pillars, accessibility, security, and usability, manifesting through Cash App, Bitkey, Proto mining hardware, Square’s daily-DCA treasury conversion tools, and a new Bitcoin Maps + Quests system meant to spark a bottom-up payment flywheel. Throughout, the message is consistent: Bitcoin must have velocity to remain censorship-resistant, and Block believes Bitcoin as everyday money is both inevitable and necessary. With merchants saving on fees, customers earning sats back, and millions gaining Lightning access without knowing it, Block is building the rails for a future in which Bitcoin quietly becomes the default settlement layer for American commerce.
“We built a fully native Bitcoin banking stack for the 4 million merchants across the US.”
“You’ve helped 24 million customers get onboard to Bitcoin.”
“Bitcoin is for the people, not corporations, not hedge funds.”
“If not us, then who? Today is the right time to do it.”
“Bitcoin requires velocity. Storing it in ETFs alone makes it lose the attribute that attracted us in the first place.”
“This is the first time a major financial firm can truly show what Bitcoin payments can look like when they’re not bolted on.”
“We launched non-custodial Lightning payments at the Bitcoin Conference… expert mode before novice mode.”
“Deadlines create urgency. That’s why we hit November 10th.”
“Block is here for the right reasons, always taking the principled stand even when it’s hard.”
“Wait, you're 100% dollars right now? In this climate?”
This episode captures a rare moment where vision, timing, and execution converge. Block’s long-term thesis, that Bitcoin must be accessible, secure, and used daily, now has real infrastructure behind it: Lightning interoperability across Cash App and Square, merchant tools that turn payment fees into treasury accumulation, open-source contributions that strengthen the network, and consumer incentives that could spark a nationwide sats-back economy. It’s a story of Bitcoiners inside a major public company bending the arc of fintech toward a Bitcoin-native future. If Block succeeds, millions of merchants and tens of millions of consumers won’t just adopt Bitcoin, they’ll use it without even realizing they’ve stepped into the next monetary era.
0:00 - Intro
0:20 - Cashapp announcement
2:04 - Early bitcoiners
5:29 - Cashapp early days
12:36 - Bitkey & SLNT
14:25 - Lending legitimacy
19:26 - Cashapp pay bitcoin invoice
21:56 - Why bitcoin is everyday money
26:08 - Merchant benefits
29:20 - Obscura & Unchained
31:29 - Fix the money, fix the world
37:39 - Value demo & bitcoin maps
44:45 - Timeline
53:14 - Vibe coding and automation
58:02 - Taking a bold stance and open sourcing
1:07:31 - BitKey chaincode delegation
1:09:30 - Final pitch
(00:00) We built a fully native Bitcoin banking stack for the 4 million merchants across the US. The stat I just saw downstairs, you've helped 24 million customers get on board to Bitcoin. Joined in June, helped productionize that and bring it to market as the first public company to support Bitcoin. Period. Like as you said, eight years in the making. It's a it's a pleasure to be here, Marty.
(00:27) And yeah, it's a it's a real long time coming. Oh, the pleasure is mine. Uh, it's hard to treat you like a you're a guest because you're such a good friend. I've often referred to you and I truly mean this and I think it stays true to this day that you are the most underrated man in Bitcoin because of all the work that you've been doing behind the scenes first at Cash App and now at Block more broadly.
(00:52) And we're here today at Cash App releases the event announcing everything that the Cash App team is working on releasing. And I don't want any spoilers. will come out after it. But, uh, it's pretty sick what you guys are launching, but not only a Cash App. I was at the Proto release party in Georgia in August. That was incredible.
(01:10) I think uh, the Bitcoin mining community and industry is very excited for you guys getting into the hardware business there. Um, and obviously over the last week, Square point of sale terminals have released Bitcoin functionalities to all Square sellers across the country. So, you guys have been shipping like crazy this year.
(01:28) It's uh it's been a wild couple weeks, couple days, couple weeks, and even months, but um it's a core principle of Block Inc., the parent company of uh all these Bitcoin initiatives, but it's a core principle to show, not tell. And so, yeah, it kind of blows my mind as well that this is kind of my first real podcast that I've done, but I I couldn't I wouldn't have done it with anybody else just because of our long history together.
(01:59) and um just like our our deep deep friendship in since the early days of Bitcoin trying to will this thing into existence. Well, we were just talking about it. I think we need to tell some more stories because I think many people got into Bitcoin particularly post 2020 don't understand how hard it was being a Bitcoiner and from the 2013 to 2019 or I would say I think when Sailor came in when stimulus checks started hitting postcoid people really began to realize the profoundity of Bitcoin and why they should hold it as an asset and use it as money. Uh but
(02:35) before then it was like we were wandering in the desert trying to convince people that this is something worth paying attention to. It was a very lonely endeavor. Uh totally uh and Twitter was often the pl Twitter is where I met you. Um and for many years it felt like kind of screaming out into the void.
(03:02) Um, none of my friends really cared to listen to me or like were convinced enough or um, like I was the crazy Bitcoin friend for many, many years. And I think there's something about Bitcoiners, especially early Bitcoiners, where they have the tenacity within them to like stick with their beliefs.
(03:24) Even I I feel like we've always known in the back of our heads like are we a little crazy? But no, no, no. This this really makes sense. Um, but it was a lonely process for a long time. And I remember a lot of those early days on Twitter feeling so relieved where there's people like you that understand the intellectual journey that I've similarly been on can understand the social isolation in many cases of not being able to talk to your family or your friends, your college professors or people that you think are smart that should have gro this thing.
(03:52) um but is a very um solitary mission but I think it it's made us all really strong in the long run but yeah it's I look back fondly of the days of Twitter of uh feeling it's like oh Marty Bent my first like real Bitcoin friend or Matt Odell or Jack Malers Mr.
(04:16) huddle like these are the first people uh that I relate to and feel like deep deep connection intellectually but also sort of like spiritually as we hopped on this this mission together. Yeah. And as you're describing that that journey, it's very I don't know if ironic is the correct word, but the fact that we all met on Twitter, which was founded by Jack Dorsey, and then we're here discussing with you guys or building a block, which was also founded by Jack Dorsey is uh incredibly poetic in a way because similarly, I was I was in this city. I lived in New York at the time. Uh I' had been into Bitcoin since college. jobs in Chicago, but I came
(04:51) here and I was just by myself on the internet obsessed with looking for others. And obviously there was public Twitter conversations, but sometimes the best conversations happen in in DMs where it's like, okay, what do we need to do? And I think you're an incredible example of someone who saw the big vision and is using your knowledge and your expertise and your ability to build things to join a large company like Block and basically imbue it with Bitcoin.
(05:23) And obviously Jack is all on board. And this is part of the DNA of the Block family of businesses. And I think for people who haven't or aren't familiar with the sort of timeline of the integration of Bitcoin across blocks companies, maybe it's a good time to just describe what the early days of Cash App were like and why you guys decided to lean into Bitcoin.
(05:48) Sure. Um, and I just want to start with saying uh I don't think there's any company in the world doing more for Bitcoin than Block Inc. And I appreciate you recognizing um the way we've approached this and we've always tried to do it with a ton of principle and with the long run in mind. For us, for me, for Jack, for everybody working on Bitcoin at the company, the mission is so much more so much more important than the money. And we try to keep that core to what we're doing at all times.
(06:19) Um, and I I mean like the gains when I say the money we because because we believe that um Bitcoin's ultimate destiny is to become what Satoshi wanted, peer-to-peer electronic cash. And so our one of our overarching company missions is to make Bitcoin everyday money. And we've taken really intentional steps uh over the eight years that I've been at the company um to really push forward that um evolution sequentially and it it started in 2017 when I joined Cash App.
(07:01) Um Jack and Doni, our current CTO, were doing a hack project. Jack had asked him, "Can you integrate Bitcoin into Cash App?" And Cash App was really small at this time. Uh it was uh an email to email based system that was just kind of piloted internally for moving money around and was kind of at at the very early stages maybe a bit more a bit beyond that but that's how it started um uh a couple years before and I knew someone on the cash app side and for years I'd wanted to work in Bitcoin and as I said uh to many of my friends from college. I was the crazy Bitcoin friend that they wanted to shut up talking about it as the night got later
(07:47) uh at uh on the weekends or at the bar as um like eventually I I think you and many of your listeners can relate is that once you get the mind virus it's like everything ultimately comes back to Bitcoin uh and you just want and you want to share it with everybody and um so I annoyed all of my friends for a long time but at least that reputation stuck in because when they wanted to production I bringing Bitcoin to Cash App to actual customers.
(08:18) Um, there wasn't a ton of DNA on the team and so my friend introduced me to Jack, introduced me to the the leadership team at Cash App and I joined after joined in June and um helped productionize that and bring it to market as the first public company to support um to support Bitcoin period. And why do you think it was important for a company like Cash App at the time to do that being having been in Bitcoin for many years at that point? Well, for me it was just an amazing opportunity. I'd wanted to work in Bitcoin for years, but there weren't a
(08:54) lot of jobs available. I had applied to Coinbase in 2013, but it was mostly engineering and they were small and the future super uncertain. I had just started another job as well. And so um it's hard to look back um or for people that are newer, it's hard to understand how uncertain things felt uh way back in the day.
(09:19) And I think we owe a lot of that certainty and conviction and um stability now to a lot of the early moves of companies like Cash App and the many many other contributors that helped get us to this point. But I mean there were unbelievable hurdles to jump through um as the first public company um not only regulatory wise not just with the government but even internally within Square it was just Square at the time.
(09:51) Um Square SQ was what had IPOed what everybody knew was the big brand and Cashup was the little brother uh within the company and was actually losing a ton of money. It was actually like potentially disastrous for the entire for the entire company if they didn't find a sustainable business model. But right around that same time on Cash App, things started to click.
(10:12) And I wouldn't credit it all to Bitcoin uh or even most of it to Bitcoin. Bitcoin certainly provided a nice boost there and brought a lot of attention to it to the broader sort of market and audience. But right around that time we clicked and found a sustainable growth model as well. And it really coincided that we took on like um exponential growth at that point.
(10:36) So almost from like the the day I started um it was kind of strap your seatelt in and and get going. And ultimately um we're now at the point we scaled like crazy over the last eight six eight I mean four like a throughout the last my entire time we've been scaling like crazy and we I remember talking with um Owen who's now like head of business across all of Block Inc.
(11:07) But we looked at each other in 2017 or 2018 and Apple had just come out with their wallet. Venmo was so far ahead of us in terms of like um people knowing who where they were and actual user counts and volume and all that. We looked at each other and was like like if we do this if we actually catch these guys this is going to be crazy.
(11:26) This is going to be some sort of um some sort of movie looking back on it and at this point we're at 58 million monthly users. for one of the biggest debit card programs in all of the US. And so, uh, it's been a super like an incredible journey, um, integrating Bitcoin into this ecosystem, but also growing that broader, uh, ecosystem as well. Yeah.
(11:51) And the stat I just saw downstairs, you've helped 24 million customers get on board to Bitcoin as well. Some of it may be small, but some of it's certainly large. Well, and that's actually one of the things I'm most proud about uh in terms of who does Cash App serve and who are its customers. It's not um people on Wall Street for the most part. It's not people that have a lot of financial privilege.
(12:12) It's more it's Americans from a hugely diverse set of backgrounds, whether um geographically, socioeconomically. And um for me that's what Bitcoin has always been about. Getting better money into the hands of the people, not the not the corporations, not the the government uh or the hedge funds. It's a like Bitcoin is for the people.
(12:37) And that's kind of always been cordom to my ethos in this space. So freaks, this rip of TFTC was brought to you by our good friends at BitKey. Bit Key makes Bitcoin easy to use and hard to lose. It is a hardware wallet that natively embeds into a 203 multiig. They have one key on the hardware wallet, one key on your mobile device, and block stores a key in the cloud for you.
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(13:42) We have a lot of hardware that we need to secure your wallet emit signals that could leave you vulnerable. You want to pick up Silence gear, put your hardware in that. I have a tap signer right here. I got the silent card holder. Replace my wallet. I was using Ridge wallet because it secured against RFID signal jacking. Uh silent the card holder does the same thing. It's much sleeker. Fits in my pocket much easier.
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(14:16) com/tc to get 15% off anything or simply just use the code TFTC when shopping at slt.com. Patented technology, special operations approved. It has free shipping as well. So, go check it out. Thinking back like back to 2017 when you joined and launched Bitcoin and Cash App.
(14:38) At the time, Bitcoin was uh 8 years old, which is crazy to think that's like incredibly young nation distributed protocol to really lean into. So like the fact that you guys had that forward-looking view and took the risk lean in at that time again I will say like as a Bitcoiner when you guys started leaning into it I was like this is exactly what we need some legitimacy from a brand that is perceived by most people in the United States to be completely legitimate where at the time every exchange um was sort of a startup that nobody could really trust. But with that being said, launched 8 years into the protocol. It's been 8 years since almost
(15:11) exactly to the date. And Bitcoin's evolved a lot. The protocols evolved. The layers on top of the protocol have evolved which has enabled you guys to enable a lot more features particularly around Bitcoin lightning payments. Uh send receive being one of one of the biggest that I can think of.
(15:34) But we were talking about this downstairs like this year uh across the block sub companies with family of companies. It's been incredibly impressive to watch the speed at which you've been shipping not only the Bitcoin related products just in general, but as it pertains to the Bitcoin related products. Is that a function of just organizational efficiency that's been gained over the years or do you guys think the timing is right for these products to be released and there's an opportunity to take advantage of? So the point I left a little unfinished before when talking about cash being a small part of Square at that time was that we faced a lot of internal
(16:12) opposition even um Bitcoin's boiling the ocean, Bitcoin is X, Bitcoin is Y. Um, and getting alignment at a big company can be difficult, but over those eight years, we've done a lot of internal education. We've brought in new people that are really excited about Bitcoin.
(16:30) And so, I think there's a lot more um unity and commitment to the cause. And I think that starts with Jack at the top. And I think it um we recently had a a we flew all 10,000 people from the company out for a um a company birthday party. Essentially, it was our 16th birthday. It's a square number.
(16:49) Everybody was in Oakland and we did like essentially like a a very high production two-day conference inside the Oakland arena and the talk of the town leaving that was Bitcoin about how Bitcoin showed up the biggest at that conference and how so many people um left with the impression like, "Oh my god, I finally understand Bitcoin now.
(17:16) " Because um I think one of the most impactful panels that we had there was Jack interviewed a number of human rights activists from around the world that are using Bitcoin in amazing circumstances, circumstances of extreme difficulty um and resilience. And I think that really resonated with with so much of the company that maybe is further away from the work and helped us understand as Americans or people in first world countries just how much financial privilege we have and that Bitcoin is for everyone. Um and then there were other sessions on Bitcoin as well. But um just a little sidetrack that like
(17:53) it's been a long process just like orange pilling the world or your family is a process. I think um the same process has happened internally. So I think that's really good and that's really important. About a year ago, we also shifted to what a functional model within the company that has allowed us to be um a lot more intentional and um uh deliberate with our Bitcoin products, what we're shipping, and what is the overall vision? How do these different things come together? And like you mentioned, there's been so many announcements and launches um in the
(18:33) last few months in particular. And I think I mean this week was so exciting for me because um the Square payments thing was was of was something of really great importance for our company um but for Bitcoin as a whole. I think even when I started in 2017, people were asking me like when Square, when Lightning to like finally be able to do it um is a huge huge milestone.
(19:06) And I think um a number of the features that you saw previewed today at cash releases I think pair into that really well um for what the evolution of Bitcoin can continue to look like and what it can mean for a major financial firm to be increasingly leaning into these primitives and um the capabilities behind them. Yeah.
(19:34) And since we're releasing this on Monday and we're not going to break any embargo, we can talk about I mean the the pay a bitcoin invoice with a cash balance from cash app was something you were just telling me before we hit record. Uh there's some lore behind the uh that particular application. Yeah. So, so this feature is something that was the core primitive for how strike was actually started and it's a brilliant model because it allows lightning invoices to be paid with dollars which avoids any sort of taxable um taxable event for the sender which has been like one of the limiting factors that people talk about when why
(20:14) Bitcoin payments won't exist or won't take off, especially before some dimminimous exception comes out. But the deep deep lore is I I pulled out an email from like as I mentioned earlier, Jack and I go way back. We're great friends.
(20:35) And that that's the beauty of Bitcoin is like he has an app that is um essentially it's I would call it like a a Bitcoin native version of Cash App and they've been doing tremendously well and successful and been um awesome to to see their success because as one part of the network grows the other benefits as well and like that's something we share in conviction is like the how the open network wins and it's really unique about our industry where we can cheer with our compet cheer here for our competition. Oh, I had this experience downstairs where I paid an invoice uh from the
(21:04) Square POS terminal and I pulled up Primal App, which is using Strike on the back end, paid and boom, Strike to Cash App interoperable. Yep. And so just the more people using Bitcoin, the stronger the overall network is, and the more successful my company's going to be and the more successful every Bitcoin company is going to be.
(21:24) And so yeah, side side quest there. But um the the funny part is is like the foundational uh idea for Strike was actually emailed to me from Jack on November 1st, 2019 because we were talking about doing it for a cash app uh internal hack week. And so it was like what a that brought like a a swell to my heart looking at that like oh man simple days back then and made me super proud to see the growth of the industry, the growth of my friends in the industry and um how far things have come from that day since.
(21:57) Yeah. And it's been very obvious the last six months particularly that Bitcoin is everyday money is a core focus. It seems like over the last few years, many in the Bitcoin space, if you're not paying attention to what's happening on the ground in terms of payments, innovation, whether it's cash, humans, arc protocol, the maturation of lightning, many people become convinced that Bitcoin is simply digital gold that you're supposed to buy, hold, never sell, never spend, um try to speculative attack the credit system to get more Bitcoin. But it see like you mentioned earlier the goal at block is to make
(22:36) sure that bitcoin is everyday money and what would you say to people that say it's not wise to go after that medium of exchange use case right now? Yeah. So we we have a three-part um sort of approach for how we've served the Bitcoin community and ecosystem to get to that end goal that um I'll circle back to at some point.
(23:05) But we believe with conviction that in order for Bitcoin to maintain the attributes that make it so unique, namely censorship resistance, it requires velocity. um storing it in ETFs or on corporate treasuries and just having it sit idle there, it's it loses the very thing that attracted people like you and me to it originally.
(23:32) And so we believe that for in order for Bitcoin to truly succeed, for it to become the native currency of the internet, we want it to be used every day. And we think that we are uniquely positioned to help push this. And so just like I mentioned earlier that you know when we launched Cash App a lot on Cash App a lot of people like you guys are a little crazy for like and you're a little early and not many people know is even before that in 2013 on the kind of like that that bull run.
(24:05) Square actually debuted onchain acceptance through a third party before rolling it back after not a lot of people uh accepted. I remember walking to the coffee shop around the corner from me in San Francisco um in Knobill and um it was clunky and the barista doesn't didn't know how to use it.
(24:28) And you'd see this at all the kind of attempts at introducing payments to the mainstream um to date is that there was always a sidecar or the the training was difficult or oh the the big the Bitcoin person isn't in right now. You can't pay in Bitcoin. And so I think the seamlessness of what we've launched on Square recently is um going to be a huge part of why um the odds of this clicking and growing and um progressing to where we hope it to get get to be.
(25:01) Um it is it different this time? And you asked me earlier like is what's changed or like why is now the right time? Like today is the right time to do it. Tomorrow would be the right time to do it. Um if if not us then who you know it's feels like it's reaching a point where we need to um it's almost like which way man. Yeah.
(25:28) And um we feel strongly that um that this is the direction Bitcoin should go and people should vote with their feet vote but with their sats and um to see the response from the community the last few days on Twitter has been truly unbelievable. Um, I just I've always loved um occasionally they make me crazy um but but seeing like the community engagement and how inspired people have been to deputize themselves to go sign up their local Square merchants to tell them to turn on Bitcoin because they want to pay them in Bitcoin because they want this virtuous cycle to flow. It's like there's so many beautiful people in this space and so
(26:04) many people that are so mission driven that like it's an honor to to be a part of it so frequently and there's massive benefits to sellers for incorporating it both if you do cash and you put a portion of that in Bitcoin right away but on the payment side from a fee perspective it makes a lot of sense to enable Bitcoin payments. The mer merchants understand it right away even normie merchants.
(26:30) Um, and I think what's really unique about what we've launched, Jack had a great tweet, but our merchants can now accept um, payments in four different ways. Bitcoin to Bitcoin, so customers sending Bitcoin, merchant receiving Bitcoin, holding it as Bitcoin. You can go BTC to fiat. So that means automatically converting it uh, into dollars for like these normie sellers that I was talking about.
(26:54) They want to save 3% but they don't want to hold Bitcoin. They'll they'll do that any day. you know, it's like I don't even have to think about the Bitcoin. Yeah, sure. Sign me up, turn it on. Uh if people want to pay me that way, great. The the flip side of what we've also built is what we it's called our conversions product.
(27:11) And so that is where daily card sales come through. People are tapping as they buy their coffees. Um you set a a percentage that you want converted and DCAD into Bitcoin on a daily basis. And um I actually think that's the product that's going to take off um more immediately than payments. That's kind of the equivalent of what I like the parallel to Cash App that really we saw by sell and like being a increasing accessibility as the first step of people's journey uh into Bitcoin.
(27:43) I think that's where people can start really small, get a little bit of exposure, see how it affects their cash flows, and then observe it over time that um yes, yes, this thing's volatile, but it trends towards uh trends only in one direction on a on a long enough time frame. And so I really love that daily conversions feature.
(28:04) And then you can still take fiat to fiat payments as well. But we built a a fully native Bitcoin banking stack for the 4 million merchants across the US. And um it's really a first in the in the world integration that um it's not just bolted on, it's truly deeply integrated into the tools that you already know and love within Square.
(28:30) So that means uh your loyalty still works and um your gift cards still work. There's um just being part of the ecosystem. I think Bitcoin is a is an incredible new part of the Square experience and we're seeing great excitement out the gates and I think I think we're still just like cash I think we're early on the payment stuff. uh we very well may be early but uh we have a history of taking principled early bets and from this foundation I think the genie out of the bottle and it'll just grow and grow as more merchants come to appreciate that there's no fees for accepting Bitcoin
(29:09) there's no chargebacks and you don't have to wait at all to get access to your funds and in an increasingly digital world those are three very important attributes um for people trying to make a uh for hardworking Americans trying to make a living running their business.
(29:27) Sup freaks, have you noticed that governments have become more despotic? They want to surveil more. They want to take more of your data. They want to follow you around the internet as much as possible so they can control your speed, control what you do. It's imperative in times like this to make sure that you're running a VPN as you're surfing the web, as we used to say back in the '90s.
(29:45) And it's more imperative that you use the right VPN, a VPN that cannot log because of the way that it's designed. And that's why we have partnered with Obscura. That is our official VPN here at TFTC. Built by Bitcoiner, Carl Dong for Bitcoiners focused on privacy. You can pay in Bitcoin over the Lightning. So, not only are you private while you're perusing the web with Obscura, but when you actually set up an account, you can acquire that account privately by paying in Bitcoin over the Lightning Network. Do not be complacent when it comes to protecting your privacy on the internet.
(30:13) Go to obscura.net. Set up an obscura account. Use the code TFTC for 25% off. When I say account, you just get a token. It's a string of token. It's not connected to your identity at all. Token sign up. Pay with Bitcoin. Completely private. Turn on Obscura. Surf the web privately. Obscur.net. Use the code TFTC for 25% off.
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(31:02) designating who inherits your Bitcoin and removes uncertainty for your family. Connections. Unchained vaults are uniquely built to let you share custody to help your heirs or trusted partners securely recover your Bitcoin when it matters most. And last but not least, estate planning.
(31:18) They'll go over how Ganet Wealth Advisors expert financial guidance integrates with Unchained to protect your keys and your legacy. Bring your questions. This conversation is designed to give you clarity on how to make inheritance seamless with real Bitcoin, not IUS. Go to unchain.com/tc to sign up. Yeah. Well, and to that last point, hardworking Americans trying to make a living. I know this is something that we've talked about over the years knowing each other.
(31:43) I think we both very much view Bitcoin as a tool to get us closer to a future which more humans are free. Um, that is your your Twitter bio. I deeply care about human freedom. I think we that's where we really connect. we got into Bitcoin with anti-militaryindustrial complex sort of ethos and we're both children of the great financial crisis and I'll just speak for myself when I saw that and everything that happened in the early 2010s as it relates to Wikileaks snowed in it it became clear to me there needs to be an alternative it feels like Bitcoin is that and that's why I've dedicated my life to it but as
(32:21) times progressed and you look at the political discourse in the country right now and how polarized everything is. And in my view, everybody's wiping at branches when they're missing the core of the problem, which is that the money's broken. And I've written about this many times the last few weeks as you guys have continued to roll out these products.
(32:44) This is massive to me because I think Bitcoin is that sly roundabout way to fix a lot of the social issues which are seeped in economic stress in the United States without having to ask politicians to fix it for us. And so by enabling 4 million Square merchants to get onboarded to Bitcoin, whether that's receiving payments, letting their users or their customers paying Bitcoin, um, or simply sweeping some of their fiat revenues into Bitcoin to sit on their treasury.
(33:19) To me, that is more impactful than trying to fix the economic issues that exist in America today by going to DC and asking them to fix it for us. I think that's um extremely well said and uh I resonate a lot with your journey as we've talked about um over the many years. But I mean, I'm I'm old school. Like, I came to Bitcoin.
(33:44) I found Bitcoin in the Zero Hedge comment section in 2011, which I mean, if there was ever a a spot that Marty Jones would uh feel right at home at, it's those those uh those zero hedge comment sections. Um, but I say I'm old school because for me it was always about constraining the power of the state to act in an unethical manner.
(34:11) I was very redpilled about the foreign adventurism of the US military and um the pain we were causing in the Middle East and back then there wasn't like it it's like pretty mainstream to be like oh yeah the those wars were a disaster these days but even in 2011 or 15 10 back in 2011 or uh those days it was not like you're still kind of an outsider if you're doing that.
(34:36) Um, it's been positive to see the way things have changed, but there was a lot tighter grip on cultural consensus back then, I think. And I think that that same thing is true of money where people are asking what is money? Um, and like it's kind of culturally understood like, oh yeah, they just print as much of it as and there's no constraint on it, yada yada yada.
(35:00) But, um, you ask people, um, back then, have you ever thought about what money is? and be like shut up don't care you know like things are stable and I don't it's not really of concern to me so I think that is a positive to um that people people do feel more conscious about sort of these um macro things I think there's a lot further to go on a number in a number of these areas but as you mentioned um to me like Bitcoin has always in I'm blank. I'm blanking on.
(35:43) Bitcoin is civil disobedience is a is a tweet out I put I put out a number of years ago. And then and I believe that it is opting out. It is um putting your weight behind like building a better fairer system. And I think that's been core to to my journey. And so just to tie it back to what you said about um at Block, we want to make Bitcoin everyday money.
(36:07) And to get there, we believe we have to make it more accessible. We need to make it more secure. And then we need to make it more usable. And um going back to your kind of timeline question, um Cash App was all about making it accessible, making it instantly available for millions of people across the US.
(36:25) We're doing the same thing now with Square where people can get their first touches on it, experience it, and um increase usability and accessibility. So, um the second sort of like bucket of projects that we look at is making it more secure. Like if Bitcoin is going to be around for generations, um and the future of the entire global financial system, we need it to be secure. We need it to be decentralized.
(36:47) And so that inspired our investments in both Bit Key and Proto. Um with with BitKey, we're making it more secure to hold your own keys, to have it be recoverable, and um introduce self- custody to a whole new audience. This is self- custody that uh my grandma can use. And with Proto, we felt it was really important to offer an American company alternative to kind of like the duopoly um within that comes from China and has a uh a mixed bag of reviews from the many people like deep in the mining. You know all about it. Somebody deep in the mining industry. We I could speak for a lot of us where it's
(37:26) like thank god there's a competitor to Bitmain and Micro BT just because they uh I would say Bitmain specifically is not as customer forward as somebody like Proto seems to be already. We really hope to change that. Um and then in making uh Bitcoin more usable, I think it's about showing these opportunities of how you how and why you should use be be using Bitcoin every day and ultimately on progress it on its path to everyday money.
(38:00) And so we talked about some of the merchant benefits, the no fees, no chargebacks, instant availability, but then what does that um how do we make it even simpler from the cash app side of things? And so um we talked a little bit about a product that internally we called it dollars on lightning for a long time.
(38:20) Basically the strike model um preserve your stack while still letting the merchant receive Bitcoin and take advantage of Bitcoin the network. Um and then perhaps the asset as well or perhaps fiat. Um but I think the the the next sort of step um from this from this pro product that I think is really really exciting is so everybody in strike is like Bitcoin native.
(38:48) Everybody within Cash App using Lightning um with the Bitcoin as the foundation is Bitcoin native or like they understand Bitcoin to some extent but in any given month it's like singledigit monthly activives of Bitcoin customers but we have this top of funnel of 58 million monthly activives. And so that's 50 plus million people uh active on the app each month that we can introduce the lightning network to without even knowing what Bitcoin is or what lightning is by letting them use that US dollar balance that they all have.
(39:23) Um I think it's a step in to step towards onboarding the next tens of millions of people onto Bitcoin without even requiring them to to know what it is. And so I think that's a big part in sort of connecting the ecosystem and I think it's all going to be driven by economic incentives.
(39:45) I think when merchants are saving money on processing fees, they can pass that back to customers who are increasingly conscious of the fa the fading value of their dollar that their salary is not keeping up with inflation that their taxes keep rising. That um it's hard to be uh an American. It's hard to be um I have a lot of empathy for um people in America that are struggling. I think far too often we're we don't call those people out or they're ignored.
(40:13) Um but I also want to recognize that like I'm super passionate about um people in the developing world who have it like much much harder as well which is why I paused. But um at least on the cash up side of things like things are harder and so I think a meaningful like getting 1% back in Bitcoin from the merchant because you you scan this QR code instead of swiping your card.
(40:38) I think that's meaningful and that's something that we want to lean a lot into on um the other feature that we launched this week at cash releases is what we're calling Bitcoin maps. And so a lot of what we we love to do things that are good for our company but good for the community as well. And we love open source is like core to the the block inc DNA.
(41:02) Going back to our little timeline before uh in 2019 we started um a wing of the company called Spiral that's led by Steve Lee. We have 10 full-time people uh where all they do is work on Bitcoin. And Jack can't tell Steve or that team what to work on. They're just like completely independent just like funded by block inc.
(41:21) We've probably given hundred grants to people on every continent around the world. And so they're doing really important work growing the open source ecosystem. And that's just open source. Bitcoin block has um we have a a head of open source within the company. Our AI initiative goose is all about open source as well. And so open source is really core to what we're doing.
(41:40) And we do a lot at the company. Obviously I'm focusing only on Bitcoin. Um, but there's a lot of cool stuff going on across the company that I encourage everybody um to look into. But back to the map, we used an open source framework uh btcmap.org. And um this was just like a volunteer-based thing where people are tagging uh stores that that accept Bitcoin and it works across the entire globe.
(42:08) And it's it's actually really fun to zoom out, zoom in and kind of like see where where's all the action. Um, but with the Square integration, we made it um, we made it so every merchant that turns on payment is given a popup, a quick yes or no, like, do you want to be added to the Bitcoin map to to get free advertising uh, to this rabbid bunch of people that are part of this movement that want to to kick off the flywheel of Bitcoin payment adoption.
(42:39) And so it's really cool to have both sides of the network where these merchants are popping up on the map and then our engaged consumers on this side uh can use the map as a hub to go find these consumer incentives to go chase these deals and um support this protocol. Oh, support this protocol like Johnny Apple Seed with Bitcoin at these new places.
(42:57) But also we can point the normies in here too if we're getting um getting um sub meaningful rewards back in some of these places from the the savings of processing. And so we're calling those quests. We're going to be able to send people on quests to go find merchants that are doing a promotion or want to accept Bitcoin and get things back within Cash App.
(43:22) And the second part of what we're launching in the next version of the map is what we're calling quests. And this is what I mentioned earlier and what I've been I put out a a video tweet for the first time in my life. Uh being like, "Hey guys, what?" Um but it's actually super fun and had a amazing reaction of engaged Bitcoiners around the country going to their local coffee shop that uses Square, convincing them to turn um turn on Bitcoin payments, then doing a payment. And I said, "Hey, I'll pay out a bounty to anybody that'll do this. We'll automate this process."
(43:50) Yesterday was just a scrappy version, but I was blown away with the response and definitely something we're going to productionize and and um automate to happen automatically, but I just I pretty caught up in the moment. Just wanted to keep the keep all the excitement and energy going yesterday. So, I think that that was a big success.
(44:10) I saw our friend Paul Keating was uh was really putting up numbers yesterday. I think he put up six merchants on the island of Kawaii. You know, can't be that many merchants. Uh we'll get them all pretty soon. Well, there and to any merchants who are new to this podcast and listening in because Miles is on, just go look at uh Steak and Shake. They came out with some financials.
(44:27) They saw a 15% uplift in revenue when they announced Bitcoin store over store sales or what? I forgot what I met. there was material growth in there and the revenue like the Bitcoiners are of a rabid consumer base that is looking to Johnny Apple Seed Bitcoin adoption and so they will treat you well and I think this gets to another thing like moving forward not only for block but for Bitcoin like what do you think is most critical as we move further into sort of this inflection point of human history forth turning whatever you want to call it.
(45:05) So, I think we have a lot of pieces in place for Bitcoin. And you know what through all the cycles um I'm constantly shocked by the surprises that come through uh and like the the brief heart attacks or not so brief heart attacks um as things inevitably go wrong. But I'm always shocked by the resilience and the people.
(45:29) And I think we have a lot of the right things in place. And ultimately, we're doing everything we can as a company to make sure Bitcoin is resilient, decentralized, secure, accessible, and used by people all around. But it's um it takes more than us, and it takes the community. But I think what we've seen in the past is even when we're early, we see others follow.
(45:58) And so I hope that uh as I mentioned open network like the more people the more point of sales companies accepting Bitcoin the better. Uh go please go copy the products and um turn on get even more merchants converting their daily sales uh each and every day. to me like these bluecollar and and you know high-end high-end places as well using Square to me these are like the real Bitcoin treasury companies the ones using proof of work uh every day to put the Bitcoin on their balance sheet and um that's sort of like a speculative attack that uh aligns much more with like sort of my ethos and what gets me excited. Yo, I saw Parker in
(46:35) Sahill down in Austin spending Bitcoin at what used to be my favorite local groceryer, which is Local Pastures. Well, the best. You have Sam Moffett who's been on the show before. He runs Short Tail Creek Farms. They have the best eggs I've ever had in my life. Incredible ground beef.
(46:53) They were an early beta tester that we got on board. And Sam came on the show and I think after he was on the show, Parker and I were like, "Hey, this guy wants to get in." But at the time, this was a year, a year year and a half ago, like he was curious but didn't have the tools to do it. And it seems like you guys have made that really easy.
(47:11) And I remember what I wanted to ask earlier when we were on this thread of seller adoption. I remember a couple weeks ago when I sent a tweet out when you guys announced something related to the Square POS, somebody responded. They've been in a beta test for two years and their comment was, "I'm extremely excited for all other Square sellers to get access to this because it's been incredibly beneficial for me and my business.
(47:36) Is there any sort of data or KPIs from that beta test that you can point to?" So, I I think actually the most interesting way to to answer this is to go through the timeline of how this all came to be. Um, as I mentioned, there's a lot more internal alignment uh within the last year. A lot more I have a lot more mandate to make things happen across cache, square, and big.
(47:58) And there's just been a lot of things shifting that uh have put us in a good position to execute really quickly and and ship things. Um, but this the tests that we're talking about, we um we did a hack week project over two years ago, maybe three years ago. Uh we had nobody on the Square side. Square was doing its own thing. We were all on the Cash App side.
(48:21) Um but on nights and weekends, we hacked together a hack week to that let a very small percentage of merchants uh convert some daily sales into Bitcoin within Cash App. And so nothing was really built natively within Square. We did that for one hack week. The next year we did another hack week. We kind of like took it a step further.
(48:44) Um, but it really wasn't until January of this year that we were like, "Hey guys, like can we la I mean we wanted to launch it for real, but it was for in January was the first time like, "All right, we got people. You got a plan. Go do this." And so it started with I think in I think it was January I emailed Michael Markle from BTC Inc.
(49:03) who kind of like he runs all the the payments for the Bitcoin conference. And I was like, "Hey dude, like what if we like tried to do the payments at the Bitcoin conference and we do it as a big surprise? People would see it and we would announce it at the conference that this is coming at that time when and so we did that.
(49:26) Um but the the kind of lore that we haven't we didn't really talk about is we the product that we just launched was not built at all in April. Um, it wasn't No, we had just kind of kicked off that work and we're figuring out like how can we how can we even get this done in 2025 at all period uh even though we're going to announce it uh finished by the end of the year.
(49:53) But what we launched and actually used at um the Bitcoin conference, we launched it non-custodially. So each Square terminal had its own non-custodial wallet in there. We had the LSP that's opening just in time channels to them and managing liquidity across this and it was like it was like doing Bitcoin payments accepted acceptance on expert mode before we'd even done like like um handholding mode. Yeah. Novice mode.
(50:18) And so that felt like um so crazy that we decided to do it. But we had been we'd had a couple engineers building this on the side just for fun. were like, um, well, not for fun. I mean, I think they hoped to get it out at some point, but we had to like tighten this thing up in about like a month or two.
(50:38) Going into it, I the night before I was kind of like I don't know, I'm like 80% sure this is going to work. Like like this is going to go super well. The team worked so hard and we were so diligent. Um, like 15 of us behind the the merch the merch booth which we were powering.
(50:56) um just grinding as a team really closely together to make sure that this was a success and then announce this vision of what we were going to build and then to have the team follow through in such a short timeline was um the best engineering effort that I've seen in my career and so this week has been kind of a culmination of that. Um I was pretty like emotional on Monday um sending a video to the entire team because it's something we've been building towards for many years and um it all came together with the Bitcoin payments launch on Monday. I think these it's now
(51:25) Wednesday and we're launching a few of these features on the cash app side to really connect the ecosystem and and make it even more powerful. I think this overall narrative um and ability to actually will this thing into existence is uh is a lot more real. After the after we announced it at the Bitcoin conference, um I remember thinking like, "Ah, this is so good.
(51:50) Jack's going to be super happy to And one of the press releases said like coming out in 2026 like with da da da with all these kind of caveats and and Jack was he was like no it's like this needs to come out this year and um we need to figure out how to do it and um I basically thought it was impossible but November 10th was the date and uh we're really proud to hit that. That was with like a 100% of our focus pointed on Square for the last nine months.
(52:15) Um, and then there's like, and by the way, we're doing this cash releases event, too. And so, we've had to figure out how to get these three other compelling products um to market this same week as well. So, I'm really looking forward to the team being able to to breathe a little bit. But deadlines create urgency and deadline.
(52:34) I think that's been a a big change that's been really positive for this year. We're doing these twice annual Square releases, twice annual cash releases and um I I think it drives a lot of urgency that's led to a lot of like really amazing shipping recently. I did not know that. Laura, we uh we set a Guinness book a world record. Yeah, we did.
(52:53) We did as the official witness of the of the record. I can say we we set the record. It's getting a little hairy there at the end, but we got it we got it over the over the mark at the end thanks to Rockstar Dev. Yeah, it's uh what's incredible that like fast shipping. I mean, I texted you what was it a month ago when you guys announced it November 10th.
(53:11) It'd be rolled out. I was like because during your presentation you did say 2026 and the PR said 2026. I was like, "Oh, we got it two months early." And that's and this is another thing maybe not directly related to the Bitcoin products. Maybe it is, but we've been talking about this.
(53:30) I mean, I think we've both gotten into vibe coding AI and obviously with what Owen just announced downstairs, looks like Cash App has an AI agent um in the app, Moneybot. Yeah. And you were mentioning Goose earlier, open source sort of aentic framework or MCP framework. And how has that helped you guys build especially like in a large organization? Jack loves the phrase um give time back.
(53:54) Like that's ultimately like what we can do for our customers, what we can do for our merchants is is automate a lot of the the mindless [ __ ] that comes with a day-to-day job or running a business or running your financial life. And the more we can create wonderful experiences that give time back to customers, the more time they have for real creative endeavors or meaningful endeavors.
(54:18) And so that's kind of a a core vision for what we want to serve to our customers, but also how we operate internally. And so the number one company priority for the last 12 months has been to to automate block. And we're increasingly moving like our entire operating system and the tools we use into um goose and um a few other sort of versions of of that for internal tools.
(54:43) But I think what's um I think what's been really interesting to see over the last year especially is how it it feels like a a golden age for very high agency people um to bust through walls and accomplish things that they previously couldn't do or they had to wait for permission or alignment from this team and that team like big company stuff.
(55:08) uh it really gives people uh the autonomy to to do things on their own and again show not tell I think especially from like um the product perspective I think the new PRD the product requirements do talk it's like this is not like a a slide deck anymore bro this is like it's like show me a working prototype like put your vision uh into pixels and so that the rest of the team can experience it I think what's gotten And what's worked really well for our team this year is um rather than getting alignment across like the four big areas of the company or waiting for
(55:45) some sort of review to check this off um and like get the designs pixel perfect or um the the co comprehensive narrative on how this is going to fit into the other things we're doing. It's like no go spike it like let's let's make this work in production. let's turn it on for what we call inner core, like the 10 most senior people at the company.
(56:05) If they like it, it's like, yeah, then we'll have mandate to see it all the way um to production and to like the broader audiences versus um I I' I've just found that's been a great way to interface with engineers. I think they love spiking things. I personally love feeling it in production versus seeing it in designs or in hypotheticals.
(56:29) I think it um to see your actual Bitcoin flowing in and out or to see your um hitting in hitting the traditional financial system in some other way based on all the sort of primitives that we have within the company. To me, that's like super fun and exciting. And I think we're also seeing kind of like the blurring of different roles as a result.
(56:46) It's like designers can now code and product people can now like spin up Figma super easily and imagine things. And I've found that our team in particular has been operating super super well by being super funible, caring less about like job title and like which department are you in? It's like dude, we're all Bitcoiners. We're all on this mission.
(57:11) we have these deadlines and it's like I pulling in my my data scientist to do some product work that's unaccounted for at the moment. I'm um leaning in on my finance and strategy guy to like do the ground work to understand this new product that we want to do.
(57:30) So, it's taken a village to do all this stuff at once, but I think um I think my team's never been so tired, but I think they've never been so fulfilled as well. And and that's what it's all about. That's proof of work. Yeah. I I saw I noticed you uh you laughed a bit when Owen was uh introduced with his title because you're like I have titles that's uh I think there's a certain irreverence within Bitcoin and within our Bitcoiners period and throughout the industry but I think especially within uh our team within block as well.
(57:58) It's kind of like oh those guys those guys never fully play by the rules or they they uh they just do what they got to do to get it done. Yeah. No, it's important and and I think taking a step back and really coming back to blocks involvement with Bitcoin and making a bold stance. We want to make Bitcoin everyday money.
(58:23) There's a lot of people in the traditional financial system in Washington DC that may see that somewhat aggressive, but it's incredibly refreshing to me because as I said, radicalized um by the great financials crisis, um Wikileaks, Edward Snowden leaks, whatever it may be, made clear to me there's a lot of corruption and we need to fix the system. And the fact that Block is willing to take a bold stance like, "Hey, we're going to lean into Bitcoin.
(58:49) We want to make it everyday money." It's something that the United States and corporate culture is desperately missing and has been missing for some time. People make a plant the flag down, say, "We're going to be bold. We're going to go after this. We think there needs to be change. We're going to be the change we want to see in the world." Um, and hopefully it inspires other people.
(59:08) And you're saying other companies incorporating and like SoFi just announced they'll have buy capabilities. They're also using Spark in the back end to do some international remittance. I think it's certainly gotten to the point where in corporate boardrooms across the country, particularly with fintech and banking, the executives are bending the knee and saying, "Okay, this isn't going away.
(59:34) We need to figure out a way to incorporate it." Um, and to that sense, like not that you need to give away any trade secrets to potential competitors, but like what are some of the learnings, the hard learnings that your teams have had building on Bitcoin that you think a lot of others may run into? I mean, Bitcoin is not easy to build on at all, period.
(1:00:06) Um, and I think if we weren't so principled, if we didn't think that the immaculate conception and the lack of like foundation and and venture capitalists and um coercion that like bit Bitcoin's just free of all that is the most neutral like it shipping a lot of these features that we think we'd want to get to customers would be a lot easier if we just like used X Y or Z chain or or or if we just wanted to make a lot of money it we could turn on meme coins and all that, you know, coins, sir. I'm trying to and so like it's been it's painful sometimes to be uh principled. It's been
(1:00:43) there's definitely been like times where people are like some people are pulling this way, some people are pulling that way. And I think it requires a really strong principled visionary leader like Jack. And I cannot tell you the amount of times that I've seen Jack had to have to like s do say the hard thing and take the principled stand even when it's like I'm like really you're uh but he's just so the man. Um and I'm like eternally grateful for the way that he sets the tone for the company that it makes it
(1:01:17) very easy to to try my best in every situation to try to do the same. And so if um if there's one takeaway for people from this podcast is that Block Inc. is here for the right reasons. We're always trying to do the right thing for Bitcoin and we're taking that that bigger picture vision into it.
(1:01:42) Well, it may seem counterintuitive or it may seem like Block or any other company that's not incorporating anything outside of Bitcoin is leaving money on the table. But I mean at 1031 we are venture capitalists that uh we uh we do venture investing and we invest in companies focused on Bitcoin and our thesis our strategy is like hey this is a low time preference play by focusing and dedicating our energy and time on Bitcoin.
(1:02:15) It may not be obvious to many people right now, but in the long run, that's going to be the right strategic move if you're able to focus, be hyperfocused, and not get distracted by the bells, whistles, and alarms of other distractions as I was I would define them in the industry, you're going to have a better product, a better business, and um be positioned better in the future.
(1:02:38) You know, one one thing I was reminded of by um Pavlex this week um as we la rolled out payments was that um in 2019 we were the at Spiral we were the first donation ever to the BTC pay server team that um like there's obviously good history behind that that most of your listeners know, but it's like a free and open source version of Bit Pay and We we decided to sponsor them even though they're like a direct competitor to like our payments business, but because we believe in the long-term mission of Bitcoin, because we believe that a rising tide lifts all boats and that by being close to this project, by this project existing, by
(1:03:22) being able to learn from this project, I think we're the the thesis back then was we'll be in so much better of a position to learn alongside them and then act when the time is right. And I think we're seeing that play out um to some extent this week. Yeah.
(1:03:41) I mean, another example from Spiral is LDK, right? Like the Lightning development kit built in Rust. Uh I think that's another incredible example of, hey, we're going to fund these open source developers to work on this development kit for this Lightning implementation, and we're going to be able to leverage that. Not only is anybody gonna be able to leverage that, but we'll also be able to leverage it to make our product better.
(1:04:03) And that to your point, and that's something that I think most people, particularly in Trafi, fintech, when they're looking at Bitcoin, don't understand your point of a rising tide lifts all boats. the interoperability of Bitcoin like one company's innovation like Square you guys open sourced your cold storage your sort of security model subzero subzero in the early days like anybody could use that including your competitors but at the end of the day if it's truly secure and robust that's better for Bitcoin at the end of the day because you don't have exchanges getting hacked or whatever it may be. Yep. And we ultimately think we need to bring the entire company in this
(1:04:41) direction, this more decentralized, this more open direction that's um personified or epitomized by Bitcoin. But um I think within the company, we've on our Bitcoin team just last week, we actually open sourced some of our um withdrawal like the code that processes our withdrawals from cold storage.
(1:05:01) It's like we open source that so that people could view that. And I think as far as I know that's some of the first stuff we've done on Cash App, but we want our customers to have even more visibility into our internal systems so that so that they can know they they can trust us.
(1:05:21) Um as a company we want to get to a place where our entire road map is open and viewable and um commentable perhaps perhaps um to the broader world, the broader Bitcoin world. And so I think building in public is something we've really embraced at Block Inc. I think we can do an even better job.
(1:05:42) It's something that in the last few weeks in particular um we've been trying to do across the Bitcoin projects for Cash, Square, Bit Key, etc. But um my main focus now that we're obviously going to stay focused and deliver new things and enhancements on the Square work as well. We're gonna be really focused on powering this flywheel of consumer awareness, adoption, and um compensation and incentives.
(1:06:09) But for me, um going into next year, revitalizing Cash App, uh Bitcoin in particular is going to be my top priority. I think uh our features have atrophied over the the last couple years and we've to be honest we've um on the cash up side after years of like tremendous tremendous growth where we're just holding on for dear life um we've had to take things slower and patch some things up um and I think it's reflected in some of the care that we've given to our Bitcoin customers and I deeply regret some of that and so looking to next year um it's going to it's going to be a total priority to bring back our
(1:06:50) best customers to offer the best fees, the best experience, and um bring in some new features that are aren't available anywhere else. So for anybody watching here that's been uh maybe used to use Cash App, used to love Cash App and has maybe moved to somewhere else, this is my promise to you right now that this is top of mind and um bringing everybody back into the the block ecosystem via Cash App is a a huge huge priority for me.
(1:07:21) That's my baby and um it it was really fun to see people engaging and um seeing a lot of excitement again from the map feature. So, um, I think there's a ton of opportunity there and a ton of opportunity to to show the benefits of the entire ecosystem. I also want to I also want to make sure I plug Bit Keys security uh upgrade last week. Oh, yeah. Chain code delegation.
(1:07:44) Yep. This is uh a big I'll let you I mean your company released it. I'm very excited about the product, so I'll let you explain it. Well, without getting too deep in the details, basically in most collaborative custody um setups, um you're trusting the company you're contracting with to be able to view your transactions.
(1:08:09) And with this we introduce uh privacy from ourselves to give our customers more confidence that um they can use their bitcoin without a private company and then and maybe as through as proxy like the government or anybody else as well. introduces real privacy without um compromising the recovery guarantees that um are so important to the whole BitKey ethos and mission and there's a there's a BIP that was put out but we built this for ourselves and then again we want to give it back out to the community so that other setups can similarly benefit from it. Yeah, that's massive. I mean, I've
(1:08:51) talked to Michael Flaxman who's had this idea of sort of a blinded key path in a collaborative custody setup for years. And the fact that you guys launch it is massive. So, two or three setup as long as I have two of the three keys and I can move the Bitcoin by myself.
(1:09:11) If I'm using Bit Key, block cannot see that I'm receiving or sending Bitcoin. Fall back option. Losing one of the keys. Need you guys to sign a transaction. Yes, you'll know what's included in that transaction, but the ability to maintain and preserve privacy up until that failsafe moment is a massive boon. And thank you guys for that for sure.
(1:09:31) And uh I know we're we're pressed for time in this office, but just what would you say not only to the Bitcoiners out there, but anybody who's within the block ecosystem, whether that's a Cash App user, a Square seller, um those two particularly who are unfamiliar with Bitcoin, like what would your pitch to them be to get more involved in the products around Bitcoin you guys are launching? I mean, my favorite thing when talking to sellers, um, even if they're they're not like they're like normies, they don't love Bitcoin, but you kind of talk to them about their current financial and treasury strategy,
(1:10:11) and you you go like, "Wait, you're you're 100% dollars right now, like in this political climate, and you like kind of like like things click for people so much more than they did u many years ago. um people are feeling that instability in our economy, in our political system, in our institutions. And that was always kind of like the Bitcoin thesis 8 10 12 years ago.
(1:10:36) Um and it for so many people it's like ah we're we're the world's greatest superpower. We're these institutions are forever. But I think a lot more people are feeling the forth turning like you said or the changing of the guard or um the whispers of a new era kind of appearing and I think starting small get it's like okay yeah maybe 1% Bitcoin on my bitco on my treasury uh maybe it is good to hedge in this way maybe I should be diversified maybe I should be um looking more deeply into the into this thing I keep hearing about and with the recent news clearly is becoming foundational
(1:11:17) infrastructure of um the entire economy. So I'd put it at that. Yeah. Well, and maybe we won't wait eight years to record the next podcast, but what I'm really interested to see is like the curiosity gap that's crossed just because you have this Bitcoin brand touch in the Square seller terminal just as a as a seller. It's like, oh, there's this Bitcoin thing here. Don't really care about it now.
(1:11:42) You come back to It's like, oh, the Bitcoin thing is still there. And like, how many nagging sort of seed reminders do need before they're like, "All right, I'll turn that on just a little bit. Just mess around with it." There's so much opportunity uh to tap into from this foundation. And um yeah, really really really pleased to and honored to like get to share this moment with you Marty after all these years because um to me this has been one of the best weeks of my life finally um achieving this thing that we we set out to do eight eight years ago of connecting uh the ecosystem with both the consumer and the merchant side.
(1:12:18) Yeah, the most underrated man in Bitcoin. Ladies and gentlemen, Miles, thank you for your time. Thank you for all that you're doing. Uh, it is an honor and a privilege to call you a friend, sir. Thank you so much, Marty. Peace and love, freaks. Love you, bro. Love you, too. Thank you for listening to this episode of TFTC.
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