Key Takeaways

Jordi Visser argues that Bitcoin is in a “silent IPO” phase similar to post–dot-com tech, where early holders (OGs) are distributing roughly $100B of coins into a broader global base, suppressing volatility now but setting up decades of growth. He emphasizes that developed countries mostly trade Bitcoin while developing countries own it as protection against real debasement, and that stablecoins, tokenization, and digital wallets (via things like Zelle and Square’s merchant tools) are quietly building the rails for mass adoption. In parallel, he says the “new QE” isn’t central-bank balance sheets but artificial intelligence replacing human labor, boosting earnings through operating leverage instead of financial leverage, and keeping asset markets like stocks and Bitcoin afloat. Looking ahead, he sees 2026 as a pivotal year when robo-taxis, humanoid robots, and physical-world AI force society to confront an unprecedented productivity boom, deepening K-shaped inequality and social tension in the short term, but ultimately moving us toward a world of abundance, democratized intelligence, and a much larger Bitcoin economy for those who adapt and learn AI today.

Best Quotes

“Bitcoin is going through its silent IPO. OGs took the early risk, and now that risk is being distributed to millions of new hands.”

“Money is the last thing governments want to allow any innovation in. But stablecoins and tokenization are coming whether they like it or not.”

“Developed countries trade Bitcoin. Developing countries own Bitcoin. That’s where the real bid is.”

“AI is the new QE. Not through printed money, but through replacing people, raising earnings per share with fewer workers.”

“If you don’t use AI today, you’re basically killing your career. This takes reps, like learning to cook with a knife.”

“The dollar is not a currency. The dollar is a belief.”

“Bitcoin and Tesla are like siblings. Traditional finance doesn’t believe in either of them.”

“Humanoids and robo-taxis arriving in 2026 will force the world to focus on AI’s impact. Productivity is about to explode.”

“Creative destruction is real. Capitalism consumes itself. The democratization of intelligence is what will stabilize things in the end.”

“Bitcoin is the purest AI investment. People don’t get it, but exponential innovation is what drives its strength.”

Conclusion

This episode reframes Bitcoin as a core beneficiary of exponential innovation rather than just a hedge against central banks, tying its current consolidation to a broader shift driven by AI, demographics, and global wealth redistribution. Visser sees near-term turbulence, underemployment, political polarization, and social stress, as AI eats into traditional work and second-job income, even as it massively boosts productivity and asset values. Over the long arc, though, he believes democratized intelligence, cheaper goods and services, and a wider global base of Bitcoin ownership will stabilize the system and reward those who lean into these tools now. His prescription is simple but demanding: use AI every day, understand Bitcoin’s role in this transition, and position yourself not for the world that’s fading, but for the one that’s rapidly being built.

Timestamps

0:00 - Intro

0:41 - Bitcoin’s IPO moment

7:37 - Distributing the supply

11:47 - Square merchants and stablecoins

14:42 - Bitkey & SLNT

16:31 - New QE

21:17 - Unchained & CrowdHealth

22:54 - K-shaped economy

27:59 - Gen Z AI

33:01 - AI skepticism

39:56 - Robotics

44:32 - Energy capacity an transmission

48:39 - AI debt

1:00:30 - US political polarization

Transcript

(00:00) Baby boomers control close to 90% of the net worth on the planet. Demographics of ownership of crypto completely on the other side. Money is the last thing that governments want to allow to actually have any kind of innovation involved with it. It's one of the most significant things that's happened in the history of capitalism.
(00:17) The new QE for keeping the fiat assets going is actually in this replacement of people. For those wondering if AI is a bubble or it's not. If the market wasn't concentrated, Bitcoin wouldn't be at the level it is. Bitcoin and Tesla are like two siblings. the investment world and the traditional finance world does not believe in Bitcoin. They do not believe in Tesla.
(00:34) This year will be the year in 2026 that people are forced to focus on it. Jordy Visser, welcome back to the show, sir. It's good to be back, Marty. How you doing? Doing well. Doing well. Like I was saying, it's uh a bit colder than I'm used to in the fall, having lived in Texas for the last four years, but getting used to it and very excited for this conversation.
(01:04) As I was saying before we hit record, uh your weekly show has been a staple of mine for for many months now, and I really appreciate you putting it out there. I love doing it, but uh I really like it when it helps people. So, I love hearing it. It's great to have you here. I think having been in Bitcoin for 12 years now, sometimes it feels like anything that can be said about Bitcoin has been said.
(01:28) But you wrote a piece a couple of weeks ago that I think was incredibly insightful for a lot of Bitcoiners, particularly those who came from a cipher punk um and libertarian background, not really understanding why the Bitcoin price is hovering right above 100,000 or 18 months past the having.
(01:47) We're supposed to be experiencing a parabolic bull run and many people are scratching their heads wondering what what the heck is happening here. You wrote a piece about Bitcoin's IPO moment really anchoring to experience experiences you've had in traditional markets saying that this reminds you of the post.com bubble burst um sort of atmosphere that that was um the case for internet stocks like Google, Amazon and I think um it was incredibly compelling.
(02:14) So, I think starting there and jumping off with Bitcoin's IPO movement um is would be great for the audience. Yeah, I think I think you hit on a couple things that I I haven't spoken about before, but you you reminded me. Um first is I I think to have a fresh look at something that helps with the fact that I really didn't spend an enormous amount of time on the space until the past couple years.
(02:45) And I think my entree into really believing in in Bitcoin was back in 2020. So I'm I I I don't have the history of watching it go from, you know, from 10 to to 100,000 for the entire time. But what I do have is a lot of experience with uh with the.com bubble. And for those of for those who who haven't heard me talk about this, I mean, I was at the heart of it in the prime of my kind of youth, uh, back then. I was running an index book for Morgan Stanley. I was running the ETFs for Morgan Stanley.
(03:19) And that was back in exactly at the do-com bubble. So, I saw it um, knock these stocks down. And for those wondering if AI is a bubble or what, it's not. There's no way to compare what was going on in 99, 98, 2000, and I've talked about it on my weekly. Uh, but the period coming out of the dot bubble, it took a long time for the NDX to get back or QQQs to get back to all-time highs.
(03:53) I mean, we're talking well over a decade um from the lows to get back to the highs and and even longer from the peak. And so over the course of the last 6 months as I wanted to look at why the same thing everyone else was frustrated about uh meaning I thought we would have been you know at least three times where we are right now purely based on the network effects that were kicking in purely based on the government that was uh supporting it and the fact that I thought everyone would frontload kind of the performance into this year and instead we had the opposite. And so I had to spend time asking what was happening. I had to spend a lot more time going through and
(04:33) talking to people that had been in the space for a long time. But I really spend a most of the time with the people who had transitioned from the traditional finance world to this. And it was through those conversations that it became more and more evident to me that this was very similar to kind of a as I wrote about it a silent IPO that Bitcoin had just reached a point where there's no reason for someone to own $9 billion of Bitcoin. Like it doesn't there's no rationale that I would have in fact the way that I spoke to people
(05:03) about it. Let's assume OGs have sold hundred billion and you sold 9 billion. Okay. How much money do you have in other assets? if you've got 9 billion in this one and if you were starting a portfolio today would you buy 9 billion of bitcoin and the answer is no um you want to diversify no matter what your views are on it it's there secondly this is what happens in IPOs is that you get the original investors who took the most risk the risk when it was completely not something obvious when you had to fight through the governments and you had to fight through the non-believers I
(05:39) mean even now as someone who's involved in I can't believe how impossible it is for me to convert anyone in the traditional finance world. So imagine how difficult it is in my mind to think about everyone that had to go through this for the past 15 years when it was small.
(05:57) Uh I I think that's really where the reality set into me that all of this selling that's been happening that's trapped the price the decline in volatility reminds me a lot of what happened after finally the dot bomb the.com bubble reached a point and Google came out as an IPO in 2004 and so did Salesforce.
(06:20) com those things have gone off to just massive obviously importance over the world they had great outperformance and so I think the thing people should be thinking about is that the next 20 to 25 years in uh in Bitcoin. And I didn't write about this in that paper, but I did in the Substack I posted this week. This is about the democratization of the use of crypto as opposed to the ideology around libertarian, you know, as you said, the the cipher punk kind of mentality that existed even with the beginning of the internet. But eventually, if you want an asset and an innovation to grab everyone, which is
(06:52) what's necessary at this point to get it to the sizes that people are talking about, it has to be fully democratized. And to be democratized is not the same as a libertarian movement. There is ETFs that are needed. There are having it in terms of remittances. You need stable coins.
(07:09) All of these things were necessity. And so I really do think we are in the, you know, post do bubble. And for people that are a little worried about kind of a 10-year process, this thing has been consolidating now for a reasonable amount of time. And I think uh Bitcoin time for Bitcoin ends up being much shorter than it does in the developed market or the the traditional market.
(07:32) So I fully expect that next year is going to be a big year for not only crypto but for Bitcoin. Yeah. And it's it's really interesting to observe sentiment on X particularly. It's it's down pretty bad. People are very bearish thinking we're going to turn over and head back down into the 80,000. Some people even saying 60,000. I think a really good point that you made in that piece and that people really need to internalize is that for lack of a better term, this is bullish distribution because you're taking the supply of Bitcoin which was previously
(08:04) held in relatively few hands and distributing that to many more hands who have different time horizons, different needs at different given points in time. And I I think one can make a strong argument that this is actually bullish at the end of the day cuz you're distributing supply and it's going into the hands of people who probably are going to wait for it to monetize even more before they decide to do something with it. Yeah. I So here's the funny thing about this. I I think um I've now started so I
(08:35) do this in the traditional world in terms of thinking about the flows. Retail's had a huge impact on the stock market this year. It's obviously had a huge impact on uh Bitcoin over the years, but the more that I've spent time and I listened to an A16Z podcast about um their their state of crypto for 2025 and it was really really good and people should listen to it.
(09:01) But one of the things they they kind of hammered across to me is this I'm breaking kind of the what will be fueling this distribution over the course of the next 15 years down to three components. One is obviously the institutional adoption which is we all see increasing. Um we see it being now brought up in the banks. Everything's just going to continue to grow and that's going to continue to happen with just everything with inside the space in terms of the institutions getting involved. You'll start to get more pension funds involved. You'll start to get that institutional adoption going. But when
(09:33) you break it down, the developed world has a trading mentality with Bitcoin. So the sentiment goes up and it goes down. If you're not making money in it, you're looking for something else to make money in. Trading and gambling is a part of this culture. It's a part of the the the the the group that matters for not only Bitcoin, but for a lot of the AI socks.
(09:52) Uh when you get into the developing world, that's a different story. They own Bitcoin. um that ownership in a lot of countries is more dependent on the part that Michael Sailor talks about which is hiding your money away from the governments from true debasement not what we go through in the United States.
(10:14) Uh I I really recommend that people go spend some time living in Argentina or Brazil as I did for some of my years and get to see what true debasement is. What we're going through in the US is is not true debasement. um the GDP per capita of the US is higher than every other place in the world that owns this much Bitcoin.
(10:33) So I think what we just have to get used to is that the developing worlds treat both stable coins for remittances and for transactions in a way to have stable value. And then when you get into the potential of actually growing your money, that's where Bitcoin fits in.
(10:52) That ownership and that redistribution is not only only happening with inside Bitcoin, it's happening with inside the globe. And this is the argument that got me attracted to Bitcoin in the first place. Not because wealthy people in the US would would buy it, but because of the transfer of wealth from the demographics in terms of the ownership in the US going to a younger cohort, but then also the entrepreneurs of the world that are going to benefit from the democratization of education and the democratization that comes through artificial intelligence, but also through banking. And that growth is going to happen every year. And so you'll get the fuel from the developed
(11:21) world in the US and Europe and places that have money with the kids that are trading it. Once we get momentum going again in Bitcoin, they'll be involved again. But for the time being, there's a there's a growing bid underneath which has offset all of the OG selling.
(11:39) And that's why to me, this is a very positive distribution that's going on to sell a hundred billion from a few people. Someone has to buy a hundred billion and this is going to a lot of groups of people. Yeah. And then on top of that, you add Square's big roll out of uh merchants, their sellers being able to receive Bitcoin payments or just simply automatically convert a portion of their cash flows in the Bitcoin on the back end.
(12:06) Um obviously the the number that's being thrown around 4 million merchants across the US and let's say a tenth of those actually turn on cash conversions to 10% Bitcoin. that could be material in the long run, too. And so, the infrastructure is getting built out. It's all there. I've never been more bullish, personally. No.
(12:28) And I I I really think the zel news um when that came out a couple weeks ago uh was a big deal. Not because obviously it directly goes to Bitcoin, but I don't think people realize how challenging it was for people to even get around the concept of opening or having a digital wallet. So for you know the baby boomers control 90 you know close to 90% of the net worth on the planet uh at least when you get above the age of 65 and when you go through the de demographics of ownership of crypto you're you're completely on the other side. So, if baby boomers would never get a digital wallet, well, they would use zel, they would go
(13:04) through a bank. And if they automatically have a digital wallet, it opens up the potential. And I used to joke with people um on DraftKings and FanDuel that the second someone opens an account on there, their life changes dramatically and all of a sudden they start gambling. It's almost impossible for someone to watch a game then and not be involved in it.
(13:27) And I think once a digital wallet comes in and it's almost instantaneous that you can take excess cash and make a decision on where it goes. You mentioned the commerce side. I'm heavily focused on the tokenization side. I think tokenization uh is just a natural next step of how you get the massive amounts of volumes going through the economy.
(13:48) And as Caitlyn Long said recently, uh the velocity of money is just going to pick up with all of these advancements. But it's funny you mentioned Kayla Long because I was just going to mention I saw a clip of her on a show earlier today saying that the AC network's going to be completely replaced with stable coin and token infrastructure by 2030 which is not as long as I would have expected it to take only four a little over four years from now. Okay.
(14:15) considering um you know and again the the financial guard rails for Bitcoin to get to the level it did without already having the financial guard rails set up uh it just shows how the governments have you know can stop anything but money is the last thing that governments want to allow to actually have any kind of innovation involved with it to lose control and so what Caitlyn's talking about uh I I agree f to have it happen five years from now it's one of the most significant things that's happened in the history of of capitalism.
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(16:41) I think a lot of Bitcoiners are looking at the price action now and if they don't understand that OGs are selling in mass and you have this constant bid and a lot of people are pointing to Fed policy, liquidity conditions and saying this is the reason why we need QE to come back and the money printer to get turned back on.
(17:03) But you've been making the point that the new QE is not going to look like the old QE and AI and Bitcoin are going to be at the middle of it. Yeah, this is um this is something I'm spending there's there's two concepts that I spend a lot of time thinking about. It's hard for me to find uh writings on this. It's hard for me to find people who who think this way because when I start getting into abundance and just the viewpoint that if stable coins end up taking most if if gradually the money moves into this world the leverage in the fiat system comes down and there's this kind of okay less leverage more velocity and
(17:38) that's what Caitlyn was effectively talking about. If you leave the fractional reserve banking system and you move it into crypto and we actually have kind of a one forone mentality as opposed to a 9:1 or 10:1 mentality, uh there's a process that has to go on. And the second thing is just this concept of of time.
(18:03) Um, this is all happening so quickly and artificial intelligence has the same component of getting rid of leverage. And the leverage that's been in there is not necessarily through money. It's getting rid of of the leverage in people, meaning in a business, how many people you need to work in a company. And that process is a form of QE in the fact that earnings per share go higher.
(18:29) I was listening to someone today who said the economy is now very circular. And it is in the United States especially it's completely financialized. So if everyone you know gradually is replaced through demographics not through job losses and I want to make sure that people understand this. I do this weekly thing to highlight that there's no hiring going on but there's a natural attrition in people working in the workforce by the demographics.
(18:56) So if we have a combination of people leaving the labor force because they've made too much money because the net worth in the country is now $180 trillion, uh those people don't need to work anymore. So think Jeff Bezos sailing around on his yacht doesn't need to work anymore. Those people as they gradually leave through making money, there's no one to replace them. As people get older, there's no one to replace them.
(19:14) As people get transfer payments and they retire, there's no one to replace them. So there's a loss of jobs that happens about 300,000 a year purely from that. And the way immigration is changing. Uh I mentioned this on a podcast recently. Immigration was a way for governments to try and figure out a way to continue population growth, which was a way to keep GDP going.
(19:38) So no one wanted to end up in the Japan trap where you start having a shrinking population and you're stuck in deflation. So these countries, whether it was Europe or the US, wanted to have more immigration to help the population growth. Well, now with artificial intelligence, you're messing with all of that.
(19:56) Um, companies are able to grow their earnings through operating leverage. And the way that I I I did the math on it, for every QE dollar that went in to basically take rates to zero, companies were able to issue debt and then go out and buy their own stock. So they would issue debt at close to zero and they'd buy their stock with an earnings yield close to 6% throughout the 2010 to 2019 period.
(20:16) Financial engineering, you had commercial real estate, you had private equity, you started to get private debt, private credit. All of these things that were happening because of the zer QE world, they're not happening anymore. But the economy is still growing. The reason the economy is growing is because of artificial intelligence.
(20:35) It's a combination of the buildout that's happening, but it's also a combination that's coming in of hey, we we don't have to hire as many people and you get the operating leverage on top of it, which is more than one for one. So, the new QE for keeping crypto going, for keeping the fiat assets going, is actually in this replacement of people and this ability for companies to become more efficient, to grow their numbers, and that will allow crypto to continue to gain strength. Because if the S&P went down 40%.
(21:01) we'd have a problem because then the liquidity is going down and there's nothing going on. So it's the reason why I wrote the paper on it is that people don't think of artificial intelligence that way. But the reduction of people at a time when we need that because of demographics is actually a very helpful thing for the productivity of the country.
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(22:30) Very happy Crowd Health member for four years. I've had two children. A couple of health events in that time period. And Crowd Health has been there. You pay a monthly fee. You contribute to the crowd. We were paying $1,800 on Cobra as a family of three. Now we're paying around $900 a month as a family of five. And that's with Crowd Health and Direct Primary Care. You can opt out of health insurance.
(22:47) Go to joincrowalth.com/tc. You're going to get $99 a month for the first three months if you use the code TFTC. Joincraoudalth.comc. And with that though, we have this backdrop of another topic you've been talking about is the K-shaped economy.
(23:05) We have all this productivity growth, increase in profit margins um for companies that are implementing AI and yet the working class that is probably going to get replaced, white white collar working class likely first um is is not fully reaping the benefits of this in terms of their paychecks and their ability to um afford themselves a higher quality of life.
(23:33) This seems like a social and political problem that uh not only the Trump administration, but any um administration that that that comes after this Trump administration, whether it's Republican or Democrat, is going to have to really deal with. And I think this is something you've been thinking deeply about is is what do we do uh on the as we go through this inflection point and ultimately when we end up on the other side, what does life look like? not only the economy, what what do humans do uh if and when AI uh takes over? Yeah, the next five years is not going to be easy. Um and again, I I don't
(24:11) think people are going to just lose jobs. But I do think the concept that people have to understand is they focus on job losses and unemployed. The psychological side is undermployed. um you went to school, you got an education, you got a degree, and you were either hoping or believing that you would have a job in that in that field.
(24:37) Uh well, not all those fields exist going forward because AI will disrupt many of them. Um and some of the ones that people spend the most time going to school for, whether it's, you know, on the the lawyer side, the health care side, uh in terms of doctors, uh AI will be disrupting every job that we're involved in. Not overnight.
(24:57) It's not for people to get scared of, but the rise is for people who want to be entrepreneurs. And the difference between an entrepreneur and actually working in an office or managing people, uh, you know, you're getting paid by the hour and you get a better balance of life. And so I've said always, uh, that, you know, when I was young, my father who was a construction worker, I mean, he died recently. He had knee problems.
(25:21) He had hearing problems. All as a result of hard labor. Um, a lot of the baby boomers worked in fields, particularly in in the middle of the country in in industries that have hurt them over time. And I think young kids don't want to go into that. I didn't want to go into construction. My father had a good math brain.
(25:43) He he taught me a lot about handicapping a horse race and thinking about odds and going through all that. So, that's what got me into the stock market. That's what got me into Morgan Stanley. That's what eventually got me into crypto. And so I got to live a different life.
(26:00) I chose not to stay in the hedge fund world this year because I wanted a better quality of life where I actually wanted to do three things. One was spend more time kind of analyzing things and doing deep thinking. I'd always written and I had always done these sort of these videos, but it was mainly for my investors. Uh, and I just thought there was a chance to kind of do what I was always told that I did well, which was take complex things and explain them. So, that was number one.
(26:26) Two was to get more hours back in my life where I could be in Maine all summer and I could be skiing all winter, which is what I want to do. I love nature and I love being outside. Uh, and that's what I'm set my life up to be able to do. But the third thing, and probably most importantly, which is why I do these things and why I'm I'm spending more time in artificial intelligence than most people my age, is I actually wanted to help people get through this point. I had always managed people since the time I was 29.
(26:49) Uh I think people that have worked for me and have known me know me as someone that cares about other individuals and how they can get smarter. I'm not never been scared of anyone kind of taking my job. The only reason is because I figured if someone took it just like a great sports player, then it would force me to work harder and learn new things and keep going on.
(27:07) So, I think we're in a world where it's going to feel bad uh for people who are going to think things should come to them. They might be entitled. They might have believed something they heard. But once you get through the realization and you're young and you have to fight through it, I do believe that it's human instinct when the pressure is on for people to stand up and figure things out.
(27:28) You've never had a better time to make money because of artificial intelligence. And I think people if people will be patient with uh Bitcoin and just realize that the advantage for them is that Bitcoin is a $2 trillion asset going to 50 trillion, 100 trillion, I don't know what the endgame is, but it's not going to stop going up. And whether it comes from a transfer of wealth or whether it comes from people fighting back in kind of this forth turning revolution where they're looking for alternatives, I still think younger people have a better chance of benefiting from that from older wealthy people. some interesting
(28:00) insight into uh how Gen Z is thinking. I long story short, I spoke at Penn last week on a panel at the PEN Republicans Club uh about Bitcoin with uh with a few other um Bitcoiners here in Philadelphia. It was great, enticing conversation. The students were very uh intrigued and asking good questions. One of them actually followed up with me. We hopped on a call last night.
(28:28) He's studying finance, looking to get into investment banking. He asked me like what should I do uh after school and I told him study Bitcoin, study AI, don't be afraid to mistake to make mistakes. Don't feel like you need to actually figure out what you want to do for your whole life right out of college.
(28:49) We live in this crazy time and uh I think it's just be adaptable and try to use all this stuff and know as much as possible. But it is, it was a hard question because kids like 20 21 going to intern at Goldman like what should I do? I'm like number one congrats on that.
(29:10) You're much more successful than I was at your age in college but uh I don't know it's weird times you just got to try to keep a grasp on things as they're accelerating forward. I it see the funny thing is once I left the conferences that I used to go to which I I mean I stopped I stopped really going to them probably about seven eight years ago and I would just go out to Silicon Valley or go to Singularity University or someplace where I'd be learning but because of the relationships that I've built in in crypto and speaking at conferences I've had the chance to meet more and more people who have taken control of their
(29:47) finances and kind of figured out this balance between a job, what it is, why you have to do it, how how you choose that job, but then how you supplement your income both through Bitcoin and through financially being aware of trading and things like that.
(30:05) So, one of the things that, you know, I I made the decision, which I'll start rolling out at the beginning of next year, since you watch my videos, I I spend I mean, I I hate to tell people this, but I probably spend six to seven plus hours a day in one of the LLMs, if not all of them. Before we got on here, I'm writing a paper for for 22V on Core. Coreweave reported earnings this morning.
(30:31) stock was down 15% when we started this and on the call they said they had insatiable demand. They talked about endless demand for art artificial intelligence in their business and they had to lower their capex numbers and the reason they had to lower their capex numbers was from bottlenecks. So, I've started writing about what this means for the investment side for next year and the way that I think investors are going to have to change their playbook from this year to next year.
(30:57) Everyone thinks when it comes to trading there's some kind of like science that you need to have had an advanced degree and that's not the case. You have all the information you need in artificial intelligence. So, what I'm going to do is basically create a video series which will show people how I go from a podcast or an earnings report down to ideas, how that turns into other ideas.
(31:21) And then if you're sitting at home trying to trade, I think the great thing about going out to these conferences and talking to younger people that have been successful, when I say younger people, it's people generally in their 30s at this point, but also some in their late 20s. And what they've realized is number one, because the government is debasing everything, the stock market goes up 80% of the time. So the odds are in your favor.
(31:39) You don't get those kind of odds at Vegas. You don't get those odds at at at the racetrack. And so it's hedge funds and it's people like that that are cynical because they have more money to lose. But the reality is they have to keep doing it and there's no way to get around it.
(31:58) So, if you're want to go make some extra money, learn how to trade, put a process in place, find the names that are out there that are doing well before the hedge funds go find them. But even if they do find them, they can't ride them the same way. And so, I believe there's a way to go through and use AI to figure out your finances. And that gets back to the point that you made to the kid at Penn.
(32:17) Learning artificial intelligence is actually just using it every day. Once you use it every day and you start getting your brain trained on I wonder if I could do this and that and the answer is generally yes. I wonder if there's any new things that AI can do that I could build today. Yes. The answer is always yes. And if it's not today, it'll be tomorrow.
(32:35) And the more that you spend time, and I've seen it with my own son who's a sophomore in college, his ability to pick up things and build things now is off the charts. And it's solely by using it every day. So the people that are listening out there that have kids that are at the age now that maybe they're in high school, I would really get your kids to spend the time on it.
(32:59) And of course when watch my video on uh on Sunday and they can uh they can see how I'm using it, at least learn a couple things right now. Well, I think I know the answer to this series of questions, but I think it's important for the audience to to hear it straight from you. But what would you say to the skeptics who say these LLMs, they hallucinate. They're not reliable.
(33:19) a chat GBT just have to stop giving medical and legal advice and yes it seems like all is well and good and that demand is insatiable but if you pull up the chart of the uh interdeings between Microsoft Open AI Nvidia Cororeweave where it may be it seems like it's just an Enron like roundroin it I mean the answer um it'll be funny if I give the answer that you actually thought was in your head um my father when I was very young and when I I'm going to say I was five. So I I grew up Catholic.
(33:51) My mother sang in the choir. I you know my kids went to Catholic school. My father was an atheist. And my father believed in nothing. And I mean when I mean nothing, he believed in nothing. And one thing he said to me that I've used in almost every speech I've given in public is he said to me do not believe a single thing any human being says to you.
(34:13) It is not a fact. It is someone's opinion. So when you get back to hallucination LLMs are far more accurate than human beings are. I have yet to meet a human being that doesn't tell me a story about something that I don't go back and fact check. And when I go fact check a human, I go fact check in LLMs.
(34:35) If an LLM gives me an answer, I'll take it into another LLM and check and ask if there's anything that's wrong in there. Um, they've gotten way past the hallucination point. If you do, if you, you know, pay for the highest service, if you use thinking where it slows it down, you're going to get less and less. But it would be a mistake for anyone who's accumulating knowledge.
(34:54) Because when I ask you where do you accumulate knowledge from? Well, LLMs accumulate knowledge from the same place that human beings do. We all learn from something. Our formative years are just like a training model in terms of an LLM. So, I I just think the the people that have focused their attention on looking for negatives.
(35:16) Uh the analogy I've given is you don't want to wait too long. And the way that you hear that is if you have a serious medical condition and the doctor says you should take this drug and you ask well what are the side effects all the things you mention are the side effects with AI. I'm telling people if they don't use AI today they are basically killing themselves in the work world. They will have no chance of catching up.
(35:41) This is not a tool that you can all of a sudden just jump on and go through it. It takes reps. It's just like cooking and using a knife or anything else. If you want to get very very good at it, you have to use it all the time. And all I hear when people talk about the negatives are excuses as to why they don't want to use it.
(35:59) And what about the the sort of inner dealing between these companies? I mean, it wouldn't be happening if there were more companies that had the money to actually do the buildout. But part of the issue is the concentration. I mean, we hear all the time about how concentrated the market is.
(36:18) Uh, if the market wasn't concentrated, Bitcoin wouldn't be at the level it is. Like, I I this is very circular for people to hear from me. But the reason that I ended up believing in Bitcoin is not for the reasons that everyone talks about. Every time I hear someone on one of these shows say, "Well, the dollar is going to weaken and that's why Bitcoin is going to go go up.
(36:36) " I made a reference, which I've never talked about on on one of these podcasts. In fact, you'll be the first one uh to go, but because I wrote about it in my Substack, um Michael Milin is one of the smartest people that I've had the privilege to sit in a room with and have a conversation with and brainstorm.
(36:55) And he and I were in his in his library in California and we were having a a long macro conversation about the future and debating it. And I kept harping on the fact that I thought the dollar was going to weaken. And this was back in 2019ish. And I always remember that he basically looked at me and he finally kind of raised his voice.
(37:13) He said, "You're not getting it. The dollar is not a currency. The dollar is a belief. And if you opened up the borders to everyone on the planet and they had one day to come inside the border and be a citizen that day, we'd have 7 billion people in America tomorrow." And there was truth in what he said.
(37:37) And it made me believe at that point that all of the stories that I had heard about Bitcoin, the debasing and all this, it's all true. Meaning it is causing people to lose money gradually over time through inflation relative to the power of buying stuff. We can see it with the socialist revolt that's happening. This is not something new. This has been going on. But where Bitcoin has benefited from this is the reason the white paper came in in the first place.
(38:02) Um, governments have been doing this for a long time. It is meant to keep the debt going and to keep avoiding pain. And the longer you go for avoiding pain, the more that you create the issue. So, I don't believe Bitcoin strength is about dollar uh about the dollar weakening. I don't believe it's about the debt at the end of the day. I believe it's about exponential innovation. And exponential innovation is upon us right now.
(38:25) So AI and the whole growth and everything that's happening with these circular deals, they're all part of the concentration that's happening. There's seven companies winning. There's 493 companies losing. There's 10% of people in the country that are wealthy and then there's 90% that are struggling in some form to to to make ends meet. 70% of the country lives paycheck to paycheck.
(38:48) So this is not an economy or anything that is there. So if only the wealthy people are exchanging things. Everyone should remember I forget how many hundreds of millions of Bitcoin holders there are at this point but I think 10,000 own about 33%. So even Bitcoin is concentrated in terms of its wealth.
(39:09) So to have distribution you need to have something which isn't happening. But the good thing is the circular deals are representation of why Bitcoin will continue to accelerate and go higher because I don't believe any of those companies at the end of the day are worth the money that they're going.
(39:27) This is a spending frenzy which gives every individual AI but those companies are not going to get the revenues that they should get from it in my opinion. I do not believe they're in the end going to go. And I think when I was on your show the last time, the the hottake moment that I had just talked about, which you wanted to talk about was my belief that basically there'll be no public companies beginning in 2030.
(39:47) That all of them will basically be destroyed in some way, shape, or fashion by entrepreneurs and private companies. And I still believe that's the case. It's because AI is gobbling up everything and capitalism is consuming itself. You mentioned the fact that we're on this exponential growth curve and it's crazy to think and believe that we're on the very we're still at the bottom of the curve and to to date over the last 3 years.
(40:16) The sort of AI applications that have been the most popular obviously are the the LLMs with the chat and deep research. um we're slowly but surely or even not slowly but quickly moving to the agentic phase but you've been talking a lot about uh moving from the digital to the physical world with robotics and I I think if I'm putting it correctly you're the way you view it it's that we can't even fathom the the type of order of magnitude jumps that productivity is going to take when it goes from behind our computer screens and our phone screens and into the physical Yeah, it's it's a concept that I think
(40:52) is lost on if you if you believe AI is a bubble now. don't know what you're going to think when there's humanoids actually I mean actually doing the work and what's happening to companies and I think you're starting to see this year will be the year in 2026 that people are forced to focus on it partly because of Elon Musk and Tesla and just the reality of robo taxis um you know he's planning to have the safety driver uh outside of the car by the end of this year in Texas uh in Austin and Texas has already given him the ability to do this
(41:30) throughout the state. Uh once that starts, I mean, the world changes overnight. He that success for him in terms of having the first humanoid cuz it's a humanoid on wheels interacting with human beings. Uh and this is different than Whimo because this is actually with a car that is using vision.
(41:56) So it's interacting with the physical world as opposed to interacting with satellites or geo fencing like Whimo is is a very different thing and it will lead to an acceleration in humanoids. We'll see optimist released next year and probably factories and places and he's talking about a reasonable amount of buildout next year and the following year. Uh so to your point, yeah, I I don't think the productivity numbers could possibly be something that people can comprehend, this will have um an impact to elections.
(42:27) So for people who don't realize, I mean, the midterms are coming up next year, then you'll have obviously presidential election two years after that. Uh the labor situation in just humanoids and robo taxis, I mean there's 3 million people that uh work in the US with inside automobiles. Uh, so you've got three million drivers when you combine both Uber and just truck drivers and everything that goes on.
(42:50) That disruption starts next year. So you're you had strikes when Uber was moving into cities uh from the taxis and those were going on. So I think it's going to be a year to your point where productivity boom is a good thing but not in the K-shaped economy when you have so many people that are already suffering and this is just going to add to at least the anxiety if not the jobs. Yeah.
(43:17) Yeah, cuz you think about it, Uber, Door Dash, they've popularly become the second jobs that people depend on. They'll work during the day at an for an hourly wage and then try to make some extra money by driving Uber. And that second option, which is the first option for many people as well, is about to be undercut cuz I I saw people sharing screenshots of the the price of a robo taxi versus Uber earlier this week. And it's it's going to be undeniable as a consumer.
(43:43) It's going to be like, do I want to pay $25 or $5? Yeah. And I don't think you can avoid it in um you know, if you get into the whole red state, blue state, and you think that they're going to regulate this in blue states. Your point is the one I've made repeatedly, which is if we've got an inflation problem in cities, and the affordability is is uh the issue.
(44:05) You can't have you can't have driverless uh robo taxis be 60 70% less than than an Uber inside New York City and not have you know the young people basically demanded that that it be there. Uh you're going to have a lot of issues. I I this is that's why I say the next 5 years are going to be an adjustment period that's going to be very very challenging for people to deal with these headwinds uh that are coming when it comes to anxiety over labor.
(44:34) And sort of shifting gears and think order of operations here. You mentioned earlier there's no such thing as a dead GPU right now. This is what Nvidia, OpenAI, Google, Meta, Claude, Anthropic are saying. However, there are dead GPUs and those are the ones that can't be plugged in because the energy isn't there.
(44:58) How do we like this is think of order of operations to get to these end states that we're discussing here. We need way more energy capacity in your mind. What is what is the current state of the the energies built out side of things? I mean core we've highlighted uh some of it today. Now theirs wasn't directly related to energy.
(45:18) It was to power shells but the power shells are you know from the reetss and the buildout places and that it's going to be a problem. Um I I I don't think it's going to be a catastrophe. I do think that the issue for next year uh is going because of the tariffs that went on this year. You have a lot of delays in terms of people not buying stuff.
(45:42) You've got transformer buildout issues. Uh if there's one thing about the tariffs that isn't appreciated by investors yet, it's the delays that you're mentioning. So Oracles mentioned delays. Uh GE Ver Venova has mentioned delays. they've talked about transformers and um uh and gas turbines are a problem.
(46:10) So I think to your point uh the the chips are there the buildout will continue. Um it will be global so it's not just in the US and if we don't have the power here we'll be using the chips in other places. I do think next year is a year that you want to be long energy and I think you want to be long things that are related to manufacturing kind of buildout related to it.
(46:28) Uh I've talked about PMIs which are very important uh for the market as a whole. I think they're going to do well and one thing for people listening who are who are trading this uh bottleneck problem has a lot more implications for for a part of the market that's done extremely well.
(46:47) So, I mentioned large cap names, but also coreweave that are names that have done well with the trading community this year that are probably going to have some issues. Well, I think you're going to have similar issues that are going to pop up for things like the nuclear names, uh, uranium, everything on that front. And it's not because anything has changed in terms of nuclear is going to be a need.
(47:07) But I think what investors particularly in in the institutional side are going to be rewarding is earnings growth where revisions are not going down. And the problem is if Cororeweave is having to lower their numbers significantly. We're talking about cap capex down 40%. uh if Oracle is saying they have capacity constraints, their stock has fallen from that 30% upday that was historic, they've given back the entire gain.
(47:36) Now I think you're just people have to start to shift gears and I think it's going to be a little bit more of a boring year and to your point I think energy energy energy is going to be the focal point of next year. Yeah. And and that's the thing that surprised me uh uh is I've been in Bitcoin mining professionally for six years now and the meme within the mining industry has been capacity capacity capacity build out buildout build up and it feels like there's been an overindexing on capacity expansion which is happening at a good clip in certain parts of the country Texas specifically but it seems like while we're building out all this capacity people have neglected transmission and I FK uh dropped a
(48:17) report a couple of weeks ago basically highlighting like hey we can expand the capacity but we need to focus on transmission as well which is something that many people have missed. Yeah, it's a big part of it. I mean that that's the issue is that the actual ability to take it from where it is and get it to the data centers is another issue and that those capacity issues are going to be there all next year and a lot of these companies particularly when you get into the Bitcoin miners and Oracle as well but take they're using a
(48:45) lot of debt to fund this and so the problem you run into is these are longterm situations. It's not just about earnings now. It's not just about what's coming now. there's a bit of it, if not a lot of it, that's on spec and time is the issue. If it takes a year longer for the project to get to where it is, that's a very dangerous situation uh in this type of world.
(49:14) And one of the reasons is and I I was saying this to someone today uh when talking about some of the altcoins and getting into a discussion uh and I I briefly brought this up with you. This concept of time is really important when thinking about investments. That's what made it ironic when they were floating around a 50-year mortgage thing. It's like, okay, so let's get this thing.
(49:39) I'm talking about how a day is like what used to be a month and how a year is what used to be a decade, and we're going to issue 50-year mortgages, which to me are like five times. So, these are like 250-year mortgages in AI time. um the time for a company to actually meet the numbers that they're going to have is much shorter and and so when you're taking out debt to fuel something, you're making a bet that there won't be a better solution to the problem with inside the next year and a half.
(50:06) And I think that is a very dangerous thing in this. There's so many dollars that are being spent that are a bubble. um lots of this stuff people are taking debt and some of these companies will not actually be able to build out the stuff that they had.
(50:25) I'm not going to say it's going to be like Chinese ghost cities, but I'm going to say there's going to be a lot of data center buildouts that don't get finished. Uh that, you know, they'll find them a better solution that doesn't involve the transmission lines and the whole buildout that's going to take a lot of time. So, I just think that when people go through this, they have to think about time.
(50:41) And every year the investments to me that are going to be the best are the ones that you can guarantee, okay, I think this company is going to take their earnings from five to eight this year. Not a company that has their earnings at five, and they're going to ratchet them down to 4.8 this year, but they're going to be 10 next year.
(51:00) I don't think the market's going to reward uh people like companies like that. And I think there's going to be a lot of them that are having uh the backlog and the constraints that you're referencing. Do you think this time issue was underlying uh what OpenAI did last week when they sort of uh implicitly asked for a backs stop from the US government? Uh yeah, it was taken a little bit out of out of context.
(51:26) I I I saw the um I saw the transcript of the words and stuff and I I think she just made a really bad decision on a word and everyone now in X and social media just jumps on anything that people say like it's gospel. Uh I the numbers are huge. There's no way around it. If you if if if I had to pick a company that was the most likely in mine, like I'll do a little early Kentucky Derby AI bubble fest uh and just give my favorite at this point.
(51:53) I think Open AI shows all the signs of of a company that's just desperate to do something for I don't even want to say ego. Uh but it's a little scary to me that when you have he just his responses to questions the past history he had with kind of the mutiny that was going on.
(52:19) Uh the fact that Masasan is involved and he hasn't always been the best judge of when timing on things. I just get the impression that OpenAI may be the company that's fighting off more than they can chew. And I understand they're doing what any company would do in their position, which is they have 800 million users. They've dominated and you don't want to lose those users. So you have to find a way to monetize them.
(52:42) And to do that, he needs more compute and more power. He needs to be able to release uh more applications to get the revenues. But the reality is uh I think the issues that are popping up with open AI just show how big of a a risk they're taking and how on edge the company leaders are. Yeah, his comments on the uh BG Squared podcast were a bit perplexed.
(53:06) A lot of hubris in the in the response to Brad there. I I was at a a dinner last week in Boston with um let's just say a lot of portfolio managers that manage a lot of money and we we spends a decent amount of time on Sam Waldman's response to uh Brad Gersonner's question and these guys are are trained in uh you know in reading management and it was not a good look for anyone at the table in terms of the way he responded and then and then how he left later uh And I like you listen to the whole podcast, but we had a long conversation on it. So I think this this um feeling of, you know, these kids are
(53:47) running a a and I say kids cuz Sam Walton's not an old guy. Uh $1.4 trillion dollars of of needs to spend. That's a big number to give to to someone who hasn't proven to run a business uh before. So I I just think there'll be plenty of bad investments with inside there.
(54:11) But that doesn't change the fact that AI itself is not a bubble and the benefits that are going to come are more like on the productivity side. I just think people should shift their attention more to the productivity side and probably less to this uh speculative buildout side. Who do you think is best positioned? Uh I mean on the LLM side I think I think Google. Um I I like I like the way Demisabis talks.
(54:37) I I like the Google products on this. I I think Gemini is the best model. Uh so I I think they have the resources. They're the only one that has a a competitor to uh Nvidia's GPUs. So the only one that doesn't depend on the GPUs. So if I had to guess, I I would I would I would say Google. I think Tesla's best set up for the next stage in the physical side.
(55:00) And I actually think that that's probably the most valuable that exists. Um, if I had to say one thing, the the reason Nvidia is in the position it is, and this is for everyone who just wants to hear my take on Tesla, Nvidia put themselves in a in a position where they have the scale capable of delivering the GPUs and they have a mode around their business.
(55:22) Um, if anyone wants to kind of measure uh a true AI situation, if Nvidia started to go down, that would say to me that we have a problem in in AI investments because the stock is way too cheap for the moat that they have on their business.
(55:45) uh it's just way too cheap for the total revenues that are coming in the next five years or the total capex spend and what percent they get of that and how it's almost unthinkable for anyone else to use them for any of their data center buildouts because they've been doing it for so long they can do the size their clusters have worked in the size that they are it just it doesn't make sense but Tesla and Alon Musk he's had this vision for I mean he laid this out 20 years ago uh he's built the scale. I mean, I always joke with people.
(56:16) I'm like, "Have you ever seen the Gigafactory in Nevada and just like looked at the size and realized how many football fields you could be playing in that thing?" And it's, you know, one of the fifth, I don't know, top five largest buildings on the planet. That's like China style stuff. And he built this out a long time ago to make sure that he'd have the batteries, all of the stuff that he has in Texas that he's built out.
(56:41) um he just has a huge advantage on the autonomy side going forward that I don't think anybody can compete with. And so if you believe the TAM on robo taxis, you believe the TAM on uh on humanoids, that's coming soon. I don't see anyone that can compete with them. So uh Google on the LLM side for me. Uh but I would I would say Tesla is the biggest upside of any company by far.
(57:02) Well, I'm sure I I'm pretty confident that you saw it, too, with the trillion dollar package and then his response to um I forget which representative it was saying this should never exist, but I I think it was actually extremely important that he gave a response he did. Um but people look at the trillion dollar um sort of bonus package if they hit certain KPIs and say that's crazy.
(57:26) But building on what we were saying earlier, if they can actually go out and successfully execute on robo taxi uh and Optimus, the the TAM for those things is going to be enormous. And it may sound crazy to people, but a trillion dollar options package is actually justified if he can execute on it. Again, the the shareholders voted. Um those are his bosses. They could have kicked him out.
(57:53) I mean, Sam Alman was close to that situation and then seems like Microsoft forced him to be back. Um, I I don't like the democracy we live in. It's the country we live in. I mean, people got to have their vote. They got to have their say, and in the end, he got over 70% of the votes. Um, it's it's their company. People don't have to own the stock. And trust me, the people that don't agree with the trillion dollar package, they don't own the stock.
(58:19) So, um, there's a lot of people I I can tell you I've been shocked. Um, in fact, I say this all the time. Uh, I'll I'll say it again. Tesla is very close in market cap to Bitcoin. Bitcoin and Tesla are like two siblings. Um, the investment world on the traditional finance world does not believe in Bitcoin. They do not believe in Tesla.
(58:43) Um, I I it's it's a fascinating combination, but those two things to me work hand inand together. I believe they are the two best assets to own next year and they are ones that have the same thing. There's no story for Bitcoin to convince people in the traditional finance world that it will ever work. And in the same way, people can't believe Tesla.
(59:04) So, well, Bitcoin I can I can sort of see more of. It's like, okay, it's this foreign digital currency does one thing. Digital gold sort of boring. Governments will never let it happen. Well, and it's hard to see the wins that that Bitcoin has had unless you're holding it and using it and watching it build out. But I feel like Tesla's way more tangible.
(59:22) And not only Tesla, but you look at XAIX, um, SpaceX, everything he's been able to execute on over the last two decades. And it's like, how could you uh not acknowledge that there is something here? Yeah, I I guess I agree. But there's two things that you're leaving at. One is the valuation between the two is the same to them.
(59:46) Meaning when you throw valuation in, it's like if Tesla was trading at $5 a share, then people would be interested. They don't like it because of the valuation and the size. The second thing is, and this is, you know, I mean this is kind of a a hard thing for people to hear, but in the traditional finance world, if you've been successful enough to have an opinion that people care about on Tesla, you probably went to a really good school and you probably have a pretty big ego.
(1:00:16) And at some point, you've said Tesla's a scam or Elon Musk is a scam. So, you're also asking people to change their mind. And I'm just telling you from working around people like that for the my entire career, it's not their specialty to admit they're wrong. Yeah. Well, as it pertains to that specific politician, we'll we'll end on this topic because I think um it's important to bring up it seems clear to me and I've written I wrote a newsletter about it last week that United States the sort of political atmosphere is such everybody's being driven to the polar ends. You have obviously M Donnie um the Democratic socialist in New York and
(1:00:53) then you have people who don't think Trump is being as rightwing enough and are looking for a strong man to fix the economic issues. When I look forward I think of sort of impediments to um this sort of advancement in technology driven by AI um the advancement of Bitcoin. The one thing outside of energy that I can think stopping it is just like social incohesion in the United States that this hits a boiling point. And that's why I mentioned I was happy that Elon stuck up for himself um in that thread
(1:01:27) by quote tweeting that politician because I think he put it out in simple terms like hey we live we're supposed to live in a capitalist democratic society. If you want good things, the people that bring you the good things need to be rewarded. And that message is being completely lost. Um these days as people due to the effects of the K-shaped economy are looking for solutions that um that can help relieve their financial pain.
(1:02:01) So I I I've talked a lot about this in other podcasts um but I I'll bring it up here if people haven't spent time with Joseph Shumpeter and go into LLM's and just, you know, ask for a two-page kind of write up on the summary of his views on creative destruction. He called this entire thing um and he said eventually capitalism will consume itself and socialism will rise and there will be unrest.
(1:02:37) And you know, the only thing he didn't write about is the creative destruction, eventually getting to the democratization of intelligence, which will lower all prices to zero. And that's kind of the endgame for me is that that's why when I talk about abundance, it's something I believe in. And part of it from going to Singularity University as often as I did um when it mattered the most when I was trying to answer a question of how are we going to continue to grow if population is not going to grow and if we're coming out of the great financial crisis with all this debt there's no way the pensions the liabilities that we have social security
(1:03:09) these are problems that are honestly unfixable. That's why there's always kind of a a debt scare that comes in. So, I had to I had to come to a solution of what is the endgame? Because I know one thing, the human race continues on. We're not going to have, you know, if if if there's less people in poverty than ever before and if life extension is going to start to accelerate, how does that solve itself? And that was what brought me to Bitcoin at the end is a belief that as things become free, as we get to the point that the cost of all
(1:03:45) goods and making all things in 15 years, 20 years, not in 5 years, but down the road, uh that will normalize things and politics and things like that. Governments don't fix problems. Their job is to keep from the chaos from ensuing. They don't fix anything. and they never have in any time I've heard a leader could come to change things.
(1:04:10) Uh I needed some guiding principle that made me believe that it was good to be optimistic. I mean, I have a hat on that says half full. I'm a I'm a really optimistic person who's happy, who loves life. Like I said, I love nature. I love Maine. I love skiing. I love all of that. I needed an endgame that actually made me feel that it wouldn't end with a nuclear bomb in a war or with people killing themselves out in the street.
(1:04:30) And I do believe that that's going to come from artificial intelligence, that that's going to come from super intelligence. So, I've kind of left it, Marty, where um I always say Bitcoin is the purest AI investment or trade. People always respond the same way. I don't get it. I don't see the connection. And I go, I've been hurt.
(1:04:51) I've been told that my entire life. Uh I I sometimes maybe overthink things. I get a little too deep uh on some things. But the reality is if you really think about what Bitcoin represents, if you think about what the internet represents, if you think about about what mobile represents, they all represent a growth and decentralization and democratization, not with inside the wealthy place, but the globe.
(1:05:15) And that's why I wrote the paper that I did this week about living in Brazil and seeing true poverty and living with it and going to weddings with people that were there in the fllas and actually seeing it. It's a very different situation outside of here and I think the democratization of intelligence is going to lead to a better world for everybody.
(1:05:32) It's just going to take some time and during that time people better learn AI and learn how to embrace it and use it because that's the key to getting happy is to make sure that you have some optimistic side to you. Well, let's end it on an optimistic note. Jordy, thank you for your time and thank you for doing what you do.
(1:05:51) And like I said, it's been uh part of my weekly routine, the Sunday morning before church, watching the videos if they're out before 10:30 mass and uh going and reflecting on them. So, thank you. I I appreciate that, Marty. I like to be before God. So, it was good. I you you get to go spend your time in church. I get to get you all teed up.
(1:06:11) Uh get you in a happy mood, and then you can go off and uh and get some enlightenment as opposed to just some market information. Well, thank you. and um hope you enjoy your day. We'll do this again at some point. I look forward to it. Thanks. All right. Peace and love, freaks. Okay. Thank you for listening to this episode of TFTC.
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